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What the hell are bitcoins?

#71FeatherwindPosted 12/6/2013 12:26:54 PM
Spacewhizguy posted...
Featherwind posted...
Also I'm sure it will be made illegal if it ever gets big because of the environmental concerns.

In a single sentence, you showed that you very little about bitcoins, economics, and current events.

Congrats.


How exactly did I show that "I very little" about those things? Elaborate please.

I know it's easier to be just sarcastic but without any meaningful content your post isn't very useful or needed.

ElementalWind posted...
I will use Bitcoin 2.0 if they solve this issue, because it should be solveable.
Which issue? That lots of people want to mine, so their work needs to be devalued in order to limit how quickly new coins are produced?


The issue with wasting resources. You could create a working currency of tokens that people get when they spoil edible food for example. Just because something can work as a currency doesn't mean society has to accept it.
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pathological
#72ElementalWindPosted 12/6/2013 9:58:40 PM
How exactly did I show that "I very little" about those things? Elaborate please.
For one thing, if you'd been following the related news at all, you'd know the worries people have around bitcoin's legal status have nothing to do with the cost of electricity spent on mining.

You could create a working currency of tokens that people get when they spoil edible food for example.
I rather doubt you'd be able to build that into a proof-of-work system as reliable as bitcoin's.
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"debates are contests of rhetoric, not argumentative rigor." -DragooneerZero
#73MyzeryPosted 12/7/2013 3:02:05 AM
Ch3wy posted...
Imagine some guy saying "Hey solve 2+2 and I'll give you money" and then you solve it and he gives you money. Then he keeps giving you harder problems like advanced calculus and giving you the same amount of money for solving them. And he just keeps making them harder and harder and doesn't leave your house. So you're like "Dude, I don't know. Please leave I just want to go to sleep I can't solve this problem." But he doesn't. He just stands there, watching you sleep.

Now imagine that you're a computer. And so is that guy in your house.

That's bitcoins.


my sides XD
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If you kill a man, you're a murderer. If you kill many, you're a conqueror. If you kill them all, you're a god.
#74Abiz_Posted 12/7/2013 3:18:33 AM(edited)
My biggest regret... I knew about it damn it....Just another reason World of Warcraft is evil...
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Interestingly enough, video game companies used to be able to make money without selling out like cheap prostitutes.-KaiserWarrior
#75jakisthePosted 12/7/2013 3:25:32 AM(edited)
I'm still confused as to the math bit. If it's the same problem, it'd be solved easily by now. If it gets increasingly harder, either someone is designing said math themselves, or there's an algorithm which generates them. Both should be easy enough to work back from, so how has no one solved it?

To say nothing of the fact that - what makes solving math valuable? What program accepts the aforementioned answers and assigns it a value? What says "this is right, here is some worth to be part of a coin"? Plus I'm fairly certain nothing is untraceable online...

Anyway, Bitcoins will never, ever become big. Ever. Their prices are WAY too volatile for anything real, and if they become less volatile and bigger, governments will just completely ban their use since an uncontrolled currency is a colossal problem for pretty much every country in the world thanks to the trilemma. They might be good as an investment vehicle, but at the moment, they are still far too volatile and too much of it is untested or nebulous.

I may not know computational math, but I do know banking and economics, and Bitcoins are just another thing that rebellious high school CS people think is the future but in reality will go absolutely nowhere.
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-Why is there yogurt in this cap?!
-It used to be milk, but, well, time makes fools of us all. (cookie for reference)::160 cookies given thus far::
#76FeatherwindPosted 12/7/2013 6:41:40 AM(edited)
ElementalWind posted...
How exactly did I show that "I very little" about those things? Elaborate please.
For one thing, if you'd been following the related news at all, you'd know the worries people have around bitcoin's legal status have nothing to do with the cost of electricity spent on mining.

You could create a working currency of tokens that people get when they spoil edible food for example.
I rather doubt you'd be able to build that into a proof-of-work system as reliable as bitcoin's.


I did say that "if it ever gets big". Maybe I should have worded it better but that implies: "if it gets over it's current issues". Of course it can be made illegal for some other reason too.

It would be a highly impractical system but my point was not the practicality of it vs. Bitcoin. It could theoretically work as a currency too but it probably wouldn't get accepted by society because it is obviously a waste of fuel and human effort.
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pathological
#77analogmanPosted 12/7/2013 6:44:07 AM
so the guys making the maths question is einstein or something?
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check my quote :DD
#78ElementalWindPosted 12/7/2013 7:52:42 AM
I'm still confused as to the math bit. If it's the same problem, it'd be solved easily by now. If it gets increasingly harder, either someone is designing said math themselves, or there's an algorithm which generates them. Both should be easy enough to work back from, so how has no one solved it?
It's lots of different instances of a single problem: given a bit of data, find some additional data you can append to it so that its (SHA-256) hash starts with some minimum number of 0s.

To say nothing of the fact that - what makes solving math valuable?
Construction of the next block is how transactions are validated. The purpose of the math problem is to make it infeasible for someone to fill the network with sockpuppets (which would allow them to spend a single coin multiple times). The difficulty matters more than what utility we gain from the solution. The payout to the miner is a reward for the transaction validation that is part of mining.
It would be nice if we had an effectively infinite source of instances of some one-way problem whose solutions we actually needed, but we don't have such a thing.

It could theoretically work as a currency too
You have yet to actually show this. If you're going to propose cutting out an essential piece of the bitcoin protocol and replacing it with something that lacks the important qualities the original piece had, I see no reason to believe it might work until you demonstrate how.
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"debates are contests of rhetoric, not argumentative rigor." -DragooneerZero
#79FeatherwindPosted 12/7/2013 8:03:23 AM
ElementalWind posted...
It could theoretically work as a currency too
You have yet to actually show this. If you're going to propose cutting out an essential piece of the bitcoin protocol and replacing it with something that lacks the important qualities the original piece had, I see no reason to believe it might work until you demonstrate how.


What does this matter? Let's assume it is possible to create a currency like that from a practical standpoint. Would there still be a problem with it? Yes. Even if Bitcoin has solved the practical implementation issues it has the same problem that that fictional currency would have: it being a waste of fuel and human effort.
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pathological