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Why are AMD graphics cards too expensive?

#31auginistePosted 2/23/2014 6:46:06 PM
because Kaveri. especially for those at a budget.
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#32TimePharaohPosted 2/23/2014 11:22:02 PM
WyzeGye posted...
-CJF- posted...
It's a real shame because AMD used to be great for budget builders. Now they are irrelevant.


ITP: Irrelevant = Selling better than ever.


People buying a product not to use it as the product or because they want it as a functional part of their computer=relevant
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#33WyzeGyePosted 2/23/2014 11:31:48 PM
that's all relative.
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#34Majoras_pantsPosted 2/23/2014 11:36:01 PM
AMD is relevant, just not for gamers.

Which is fine. NVidia has always been much better. And now with shadowplay and PhysX, yeah AMD is only good for bitcoin mining anyway.
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#35Flaktrooper123Posted 2/24/2014 12:12:34 AM
AMD is still relevant, cryptocoin craze actually raise their sales sky high, that means they actually gain a sizable revenue from it even if their products aren't used the way it is meant to. It is good for nvidia too of course, the high price and unavailability of AMD cards also means nvidia is taking a sizable portion of AMD's gaming market, which means they both profit from it one way or another. It is just more annoying for us gamers because the prices get ridiculous and forced to buy nvidia cards whether you like it or not.
#36ukemandwnbuPosted 2/24/2014 12:31:47 AM
Flaktrooper123 posted...
AMD is still relevant, cryptocoin craze actually raise their sales sky high, that means they actually gain a sizable revenue from it even if their products aren't used the way it is meant to.


I'm been seeing people say this, but I'm not understanding what "bitcoin mining" or "cryptocurrency mining" are.

What is it, and why AMD products? What are people doing with them that they aren't used as intended? (Do you mean people are buying AMD just for the bitcoins?)

If someone could provide me a link explaining this stuff, or if anyone is willing to explain these things to me, I would appreciate it. Forgive my lack of knowledge on the subject.
#37Kokuei05Posted 2/24/2014 12:40:34 AM
The 750ti is gonna skyrocket in price.
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#38Flaktrooper123Posted 2/24/2014 12:51:06 AM
ukemandwnbu posted...
Flaktrooper123 posted...
AMD is still relevant, cryptocoin craze actually raise their sales sky high, that means they actually gain a sizable revenue from it even if their products aren't used the way it is meant to.


I'm been seeing people say this, but I'm not understanding what "bitcoin mining" or "cryptocurrency mining" are.

What is it, and why AMD products? What are people doing with them that they aren't used as intended? (Do you mean people are buying AMD just for the bitcoins?)

If someone could provide me a link explaining this stuff, or if anyone is willing to explain these things to me, I would appreciate it. Forgive my lack of knowledge on the subject.


Cryptocurrency are something like an online money. Think of it as another kind of dollar. There are many types, like Bitcoin, Litecoin, etc. Some online shops accept them as payment.

You can directly get a cryptocurrency by buying it directly from the exchangers. However, by far, the most popular way of getting them is by 'mining' them. Technically it is not like digging for ore in the mine. You see those big financial companies have powerful supercomputers to calculate their transaction? Now what you do is you allow them to use your computer's power to do some of those calculations, and you get 'paid' for it in return. The amount you get rewarded with of course depends on how much calculations you do, so the more powerful, the merrier.

Usually it is the GPU that is used for 'mining', instead of the CPU. And, AMD GPUs are a lot better at that than Nvidia GPUs are. That is why miners seek AMD GPUs rather than Nvidia GPUs. Of course to get any kind of profit from mining, you need to generate more coin values than the electricity bill you pay for running your PC.
#39DarkZV2BetaPosted 2/24/2014 3:15:19 AM
darkstar4221 posted...
reincarnator07 posted...
Oooooor it could just be simple supply and demand.


http://madmikemagee.files.wordpress.com/2008/07/nvid.pdf

Supply and demand my ass, there is no lack of supply in video cards. As stated in the PDF file the cost of the raw materials and components to manufacture a video card is going down, yet the prices of video cards have not.

Obviously there is a barrier to entry. Probably nvidia and amd benefit from Microsoft's monopoly in the home computer market, who knows what type of contract agreements that nvidia and amd have with Microsoft. I know nvidia is very protective of their IP and is known to make code proprietary that's another reason.

The thing is, competition between the two doesn't show any signs of fixed prices or any communication at all, beyond simple sensibilities.
The price war between HD6850 and GTX460, and again with 7850 and Ti Boost actually suggests the companies are really pushing eachother.


As stated in the PDF file, the prices and performances of the video cards are nearly identical and it's true to this day. They are not completely buddy/buddy and they are trying to outdo one and other. But If AMD is not trying to conspire against the public AMD would offer a more bang for your back compared to nvidia products, but they are not, the prices are nearly identical. Compare that to prices of AMD cpus and Intel cpus, AMD offers much lower prices compared to Intel products. Now the cpu market is screwed up because of patent law, I'm guessing nvidia and amd benefits from patent law too.

You can't deny nvidias and amds business practices are monopolistic, they have a legit oligopoly with no other firm competing with these companies for over a decade, I find that strange.


Why would they arbitrarily price cards lower? So they can make less money?
There's greater demand for AMD's high end cards thanks to mining. I don't think AMD is even the one profiting from that. It's retailers that are marking it up. But, even if they did, they're still selling their cards at what the consumer is willing to pay despite the cheaper price, better performance, and richer featureset of the competition at this time. That's the market response, not AMD conspiracy.
For the CPU market, AMD's prices have actually been quite high compared to Intel's, seeing as the FX series processors are complete garbage when compared to what Intel has to offer. They often come into the market at an inflated price, trying to take advantage of a small niche before quickly dropping prices when they can no longer sell units.
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#40darkstar4221Posted 2/24/2014 1:00:10 PM(edited)
DarkZV2Beta posted...
Why would they arbitrarily price cards lower? So they can make less money?
There's greater demand for AMD's high end cards thanks to mining. I don't think AMD is even the one profiting from that. It's retailers that are marking it up. But, even if they did, they're still selling their cards at what the consumer is willing to pay despite the cheaper price, better performance, and richer featureset of the competition at this time. That's the market response, not AMD conspiracy.
For the CPU market, AMD's prices have actually been quite high compared to Intel's, seeing as the FX series processors are complete garbage when compared to what Intel has to offer. They often come into the market at an inflated price, trying to take advantage of a small niche before quickly dropping prices when they can no longer sell units.


You forgot to mention that the only reason why Intel has a large market-share is because their chip designs are protected by patent and sui genrus laws. You need a license from Intel if you want manufacturer X86 cpus, the fact that you need a license (ie permission) just to produce x86-like cpus is the reason why Intel has a stranglehold on desktop cpu market. Intel is the one that is inflating the cost of their cpus, Intel is the one that is price gouging their customers. Their K processors still have yet to fall below $200.

I'm guessing it's the same reason why nvidia has a stranglehold in the gpu market and why no other company has popped up and decided to challenge this duopoly of both nvidia and amd. It's well known that nvidia is very protective of their ip, they don't like their ideas being stolen, and nvidia has this unwillingness to adapt to open standards. For example nvidia charging a high fee if companies want to use g-sync on their monitors, as well making all their code proprietary. nvidia wouldn't even allow sony to shrink the die of their gpus on the ps3. The business practices of nvidia and amd are monopolistic, which is obviously a sign of a lack of competition.

And keep in mind the cost of the raw materials and components that make a video card, the costs are going down, yet prices for video cards have stayed the same actually or actually increased over the years.