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Have always been a Windows user. Want to try Linux. Where to start?

#111SinisterSlayPosted 6/13/2014 2:28:07 PM(edited)
Worknofun370 posted...
Oops was on a different server hahaha

Uptime on the one I just posted the stats from:

# uptime
17:21:44 up 1679 days, 7:31, 1 user, load average: 0.64, 0.68, 0.69



Run Red Alert Win95 on Wine.
It will randomly hang, and will randomly permanently keep the game screen, and it will randomly make the x session forget your maximum resolution and refresh rates.
Basically, after running the game, your system will be so messed up you have to restart.
And that mayhem is caused just by Wine.
Imagine what a serious program could do.

I always hear people go, "my uptime is 5 years".
Sure, but what have you done on the machine?
My old Windows 95 almost always made it to the 3 month limit if I just left it sitting idle running as a WAMP server.
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He who stumbles around in darkness with a stick is blind. But he who... sticks out in darkness... is... fluorescent! - Brother Silence
#112Worknofun370Posted 6/13/2014 2:31:40 PM
SinisterSlay posted...
Run Red Alert Win95 on Wine.
It will randomly hang, and will randomly permanently keep the game screen, and it will randomly make the x session forget your maximum resolution and refresh rates.
Basically, after running the game, your system will be so messed up you have to restart.
And that mayhem is caused just by Wine.
Imagine what a serious program could do.


Complaining about Linux stability because you're trying to run Wine is pretty funny to me honestly.

"Just by Wine" BTW shows you probably should look into just how much crap wine is trying to do.

SinisterSlay posted...
I always hear people go, "my uptime is 5 years".
Sure, but what have you done on the machine?


Used it... a lot?
#113walnut100Posted 6/13/2014 2:36:59 PM
Worknofun370 posted...
walnut100 posted...
- It has a tendency to not stay stable as long as a Windows or OSX install so you'll be reinstalling the OS more often (unless you keep pretty good care of your system)


Whhhaaaa?

# uptime
17:01:49 up 1188 days, 13:29, 1 user, load average: 2.14, 2.32, 2.43


Knew that bit would be controversial

You CAN keep it going for a long time if you take care of it and the kernel itself is really stable - but the stuff around it isn't always and there can be conflicts between software. Sometimes after major updates it's easier to nuke the whole thing and start over than it is to fix it imo
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We Americans will never take over the world. We're far too lazy.
We'll outsource the task to India, and then take the credit for it. ~ Waffleman
#114Worknofun370Posted 6/13/2014 2:40:09 PM
walnut100 posted...
Knew that bit would be controversial


It's not controversial, it's just wrong.

walnut100 posted...
You CAN keep it going for a long time if you take care of it and the kernel itself is really stable - but the stuff around it isn't always and there can be conflicts between software. Sometimes after major updates it's easier to nuke the whole thing and start over than it is to fix it imo


Major updates between versions is totally different from: " It has a tendency to not stay stable as long as a Windows or OSX install."

I agree if you're going from one major point release to another.. you may have issues and you may not. Just as if you're updating windows from Vista to 7 that you may have issues and you may not.


Software conflicts are usually easily solved as well. Usually.
#115SneakiestNegPosted 6/13/2014 2:50:37 PM
Chrome now blocks extensions not downloaded from the chrome store. Think proxmate or adblock edge will get Google approval? Or YouTube center?
#116walnut100Posted 6/13/2014 2:58:07 PM
Just as if you're updating windows from Vista to 7 that you may have issues and you may not.

This... isn't really what I mean but ok

I'm just telling you that as a long-time Linux user (Arch specifically) I've had things blow up where it was easier to nuke the whole thing and start over than it would've been to fix/debug problems. It is an anecdote but it wasn't meant to be taken as anything more than that - my Windows installs have lasted about twice as long on average

As a result though I run Linux more because with the re-installs everything runs quickly and it's all shiny/new/exciting :)
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We Americans will never take over the world. We're far too lazy.
We'll outsource the task to India, and then take the credit for it. ~ Waffleman
#117Worknofun370Posted 6/13/2014 3:03:52 PM(edited)
walnut100 posted...
This... isn't really what I mean but ok


You made the comment of "sometimes after major updates it's easier to nuke the whole thing and start over than it is to fix it imo"

A "Major Update" in Linux is typically in the same area as a major OS update on the Windows or OS X side. Well.. no... I would agree that Windows likely is the larger change, but that's the point I was going for.

walnut100 posted...
I'm just telling you that as a long-time Linux user (Arch specifically) I've had things blow up where it was easier to nuke the whole thing and start over than it would've been to fix/debug problems


How do you bust an Arch install during updates? I've been running it for a year and a half and had no issues. And been using linux for over 12 years now.

The only thing I can think of is the /bin /sbin /usr/sbin going away for /usr/bin a bit ago. But... took 3 seconds for me to fix that one by reading their forum.

walnut100 posted...
It is an anecdote but it wasn't meant to be taken as anything more than that


I'm not buying that. You were listing the pro's and con's of Linux
#118walnut100Posted 6/13/2014 3:21:13 PM
The pro's and con's of Linux..... as I see them

The switch from init scripts to systemd was a painful transition one time; another time I had ibus freezing the entire system and I couldn't debug it even with help from forums and IRC channels. And then Ubuntu blew up my hard drive on a major update but I don't blame that one so much as anything but Canonical (I was newer to it then and wasn't comfortable doing command line updates - their GUI tool screwed the pooch)

I don't understand why you're getting so defensive about this anyway
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We Americans will never take over the world. We're far too lazy.
We'll outsource the task to India, and then take the credit for it. ~ Waffleman
#119PraetorXynPosted 6/13/2014 3:26:01 PM
Worknofun370 posted...
How do you bust an Arch install during updates? I've been running it for a year and a half and had no issues. And been using linux for over 12 years now.

The only thing I can think of is the /bin /sbin /usr/sbin going away for /usr/bin a bit ago. But... took 3 seconds for me to fix that one by reading their forum.


To be fair, it's possible if you don't go the Arch home page and read the news before you run pacman -Syu. If there's a package update that's going to break Arch they will have a post about it there and tell you how to avoid it.

If you are in such a situation, you'll normally have to downgrade packages. You can avoid this by taking regular snapshots (not VM snapshots, you can get programs to do it bare metal) and/or Clonezilla backups.
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Console war in a nutshell:
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#120Orestes417Posted 6/13/2014 3:30:19 PM
Main problem I see with people and Arch updates is them thinking it's a good idea to try partial upgrades, excessively long waits between upgrades or dodgy AUR packages. If you aren't doing a full upgrade at least every week or two Arch is more or less not for you.
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Some roads you shouldn't go down because maps used to say there'd be dragons there. Now they don't, but that don't mean the dragons aren't there.