This is a split board - You can return to the Split List for other boards.

Is it time to let RARE go?

#21Arucard05Posted 2/12/2013 3:03:42 AM
From: headwounds13 | #003
The people that made Rare what it was are gone, it's time for you to let them go.


People have been saying that for years though. Since Microsoft's acquisition at least. They may be a completely different developer in all but name, but Kameo, Viva Pinata and Nuts & Bolts were incredible games that did right by that name. Microsoft seems intent on keeping Rare's wings clipped though for some odd reason.
---
www.bewaretherobotsquad.com
A place where things happen. Sometimes awesome things.
#22FocianPosted 2/12/2013 3:17:20 AM
I'd rather see them alive making games I care little about, than dead because Banjo Threeie was a commercial failure.
---
GT/PSN: Focian
The measure of a life is a measure of love and respect; So hard to earn, so easily burned.
#23cup_a_soupPosted 2/12/2013 3:32:35 AM
MudbuttSanchez posted...
Funny how a company named hasn't put out any good games in 8 years.


Kameo, Perfect Dark Zero, Banjo Kazooie Nuts & Bolts and the Viva Pinata games are all excellent titles that no body bought because it wasn't James Bond or Killer Instinct.

Rare made Rare-like games. Nobody bought them. Rare made Kinect Sports 1 & 2 and they outsold the majority of the games Rare has made, including some of their classics. They made a new Banjo and most people were practically offended by it. Most people also found PDZ to be inferior to the previous game for some ridiculous reasons. (Though I personally enjoyed PDZ more than the original).

I don't know what it is people expect out of them any more. The games they make, people whine about or ignore, but for some strange reason it's the ones they didn't get to make that were going to be amazing, I guess? Because that way people get to shake their fist angrily at Microsoft instead of Rare because they made games we loved 15 years ago?

Also, I like how no one is even CONSIDERING the possible fact that they're working hard to develop excellent launch titles for the new Xbox. No of course not, it's all Microsoft killing Rare and they are nothing now. :-\
#24XD375Posted 2/12/2013 4:11:21 AM(edited)
People have been saying this same stuff about Rare since the mid-N64 era, most of it is grossly exaggerated. They've always had good games (DKC, Goldeneye), they've always had bad games (PDZ), they've always had heavily-debated games (DK64, BKN&B), and they've always had massive successes (DK games, Goldeneye, Banjo games, Kinect Sports games). The only "mass exodus" of employess was when part of the Goldeneye/Perfect Dark team left in 1999 to form Free Radical Design. Others like David Wise, Grant Kirkhope, and Chris Seavor have left since then, but people like Gregg Mayles, Robin Beanland, and Leigh Loveday are still around. The turnover is comparable to just about any long-running video game company.
#25headwounds13Posted 2/12/2013 4:12:05 AM
From: Arucard05 | #021
From: headwounds13 | #003
The people that made Rare what it was are gone, it's time for you to let them go.


People have been saying that for years though. Since Microsoft's acquisition at least. They may be a completely different developer in all but name, but Kameo, Viva Pinata and Nuts & Bolts were incredible games that did right by that name. Microsoft seems intent on keeping Rare's wings clipped though for some odd reason.


I don't have any problems with holding out hope for future, but the TC is dead set on revivals of certain franchises. Yeah, Nut's and Bolts was fine, but then again Gregg Mayles is the only dude still at the studio. The rest of that stuff? Those people are long gone, and I'm doubtful that whoever is left has the chops to carry off a legacy title.
---
http://www.bewaretherobotsquad.com/p/headcase.html
http://i761.photobucket.com/albums/xx259/headwoundss/129167586636177506-1.gif
#26KOTRwhoopsPosted 2/12/2013 4:27:51 AM
Yes, MS has destroyed this once great developer. Sounds abut like another gaming company I know...

*cough* EA *cough*
---
PLAYING - Minecraft (360), DmC (PC), ZombiU (WU), Ni No Kuni (PS3)
MOST WANTED - FFvsXIII, GTAV, Tales Of Xillia, Lightning Returns
#27ValedictorianXDPosted 2/12/2013 5:21:16 AM
zyxomma100 posted...
From: staticxtreme5 | #017
snip

snip

If we were to perform a magical time experiment where Rare's games like Kameo, BKNB, and Viva Pinata were released on the N64 (with appropriate graphics), and games like Goldeneye, DK64, etc. were all released on current-gen systems, we'd see the exact same effect. You'd see the old N64 games praised as Rare's best work.

The reason why Rare's non-Kinect games have done so badly is because the game industry and market has changed. Even if they could theoretically make inarguably the best Banjo Kazooie game of all time, it wouldn't sell well as a standard release today.

Sorry, sir, but as a gamer of 30+ years and a game developer, to say that games like Kameo and BKNB would perform well and games like Goldeneye and DK64 released now would not is an illogical fallacy.

First off, you cannot compare something like Goldeneye to stuff released today without the proper ground-breaking innovations that made it so loved. That would be like trying to expect Street Fighter 1 to be successful when there are at least several dozen indie and arcade titles that have far better balancing (ie, no 1 hit KO shoryukens). The same applies for other titles. Games like Goldeneye, DK64, Super Mario 64, Chrono Trigger, etc. are great because of how innovative they were back then. If they had to be released now, they would require an equal amount of great innovation to be on a fair playing field. Game Design, Day #43. No matter how great a game like Chrono Trigger or BK is, a new release as they are now would come off as amateurish and unoriginal.

Secondly, games just like BKNB, Viva Pinata and Kameo had been released back in the N64 era but under different names and by different developers. From what I remember, the only game that would have sold well was a game like Kameo. I'm not going to bother you with the specifics but plenty of games like BKNB and Viva Pinata had been done aplenty and the reception was generally lukewarm. Even if you took out the consoles premium titles of the day, something like Viva Pinata would struggle against games like Goemon, Glover, Gex, Gauntlet and arguably most of the WCW games released during the time when WCW was in its prime and had a large fanbase.

Thirdly, based on what you've said, you are attributing this all to nostalgia. That in itself is the prime illogical fallacy that tends to cloud the minds of many gamers. Sometimes nostalgia is the reason some older games receive lots of praise...sometimes. This isn't one of those times. For example, what makes a game like BK or BT better than BKNB has nothing to do with age. BK and BT were just better designed games. BKNB had horribly empty worlds, an unoriginal gimmick, poor writing and the graphics were actually quite...unflattering. In fact, looking at an old cover of the BT strategy guide by Nintendo Power produced in November 2000 is actually more appealing than the cover art or the in-game graphics of BKNB combined. You boys can be the judge of that:
http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQHrFHOD6MznBwsP0P9FcFh7sCf6JBRKFYLDMyIuuOwg-8CNKeW

That's sad.

I'm not going to say you aren't right in the head because I'm not that type of guy. Instead, I'm just going to say that you simply don't get it because you don't know what to look for. I don't feel like teaching game design when I have to already lead a dev team in about 1 hour and meet a deadline in 3 months with a sub-par budget.
---------------------------------------------------
To answer the TC question: Rare is washed up and their talent is gone. Keep an eye on Mingy Jongo instead. Kickstarter projects are becoming all the rage and who better to get involved than a formidable group of veteran ex-Rare employees? Besides, they have Grant Kirkhope. Hard to screw something up with talent like that.
---
[[[[[[[[[[[[[ |||||||||||||||| ]]]]]]]]]]]]]
#28Arucard05Posted 2/12/2013 5:23:57 AM
From: ValedictorianXD | #027
plenty of games like BKNB and Viva Pinata had been done aplenty


BKNB had horribly empty worlds, an unoriginal gimmick, poor writing and the graphics were actually quite...unflattering.



So this is what Bizzaro Arucard looks like.


Fascinating.
---
www.bewaretherobotsquad.com
It's better than bad.
#29Dragon NexusPosted 2/12/2013 7:33:43 AM
From: KOTRwhoops | #026
Yes, MS has destroyed this once great developer. Sounds abut like another gaming company I know...


The company was falling apart before MS got it. It was haemorraging developers when Nintendo decided to sell it. Microsoft just got the IPs and the Rare brand name without actually getting any of the talent.
---
"The problem with quotes on the internet is that you can never be sure if they're true" - Abraham Lincoln
#30cup_a_soupPosted 2/12/2013 8:36:59 AM
ValedictorianXD posted...

BKNB had horribly empty worlds, an unoriginal gimmick, poor writing and the graphics were actually quite...unflattering. In fact, looking at an old cover of the BT strategy guide by Nintendo Power produced in November 2000 is actually more appealing than the cover art or the in-game graphics of BKNB combined. You boys can be the judge of that:
http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQHrFHOD6MznBwsP0P9FcFh7sCf6JBRKFYLDMyIuuOwg-8CNKeW


http://www.xgn.nl/downloads/360/Banjo%20Kazooie%203/200805120357250.jpg

They look exactly like the cover art, and the graphics remained some of the best this generation has seen...

As for the empty worlds... I don't even know what you mean by that.