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Which is worse on game creators: buying a used game or illegally pirating a game

#61RintonPosted 11/11/2012 3:31:45 AM
hyjinx17 posted...
Rinton posted...
hyjinx17 posted...
Its basically choosing whether to steal the game or buy it from someone you know stole it


Would it not be more accurate to say:

"Its basically choosing whether to steal the game or buy it from someone you know legitimately paid for it"

The developer already made money off of the title once via a legitimate purchase.


you call the price they give people legitimate? I call it extortion.Also, At least 35%(preferably 50) of used game sales should go to the developer. It isn't right to sell a game new, which nets the developer some cash then give customers pennies on the dollar for what they then turn around and sell it used for. It's called double dipping.


Who ever said the price was legitimate? I'm not even sure what you're referring to honestly, so I'm not sure how to respond. Are you talking about retail pricing? I mean, in all fairness developers need to make more than $60 off of each purchase to recoup costs generally. That's why most developers are switching to a DLC-heavy, online-pass, real money currency system. Developers know they can't charge more than 60 dollars a game, but costs for development are so high they have to find other ways to charge gamers more money.
#62gjc2007Posted 11/11/2012 3:34:39 AM(edited)
Took a second before I got off, and as if it was destined by the gods of sanity and common sense....I figured out how to get my sig working.

For all of you "Used games are bad" people, click the sig and read.

Now. Sleep.

EDIT: make sure to add that "?" on the end. Wont work without it.
EDIT2: Nevermind. I goofed with the spelling *facepalm*
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Why used games don't hurt the industry and why content passes are bull****: http://umthumbs.gametrailers.com/users/noobiablos/gamepad/?
#63nonexistingheroPosted 11/11/2012 3:33:09 AM
Rinton posted...
nonexistinghero posted...
Kind of a hard decision:

- Used can possibly be harder on game creators, because it encourages games stores to try to sell more used games and some stores will go pretty far with this. On the other hand, creators/publishers may be able to offer special deals with the store in the future (as in, sponsorship or events so that the stores will gain more customers).

- Pirated games are free. You aren't giving anyone any money with it. There's a decent amount of people that pirate a copy as a try-out version, then if they like it enough, they buy it. So in a way, it serves as a full-game demo for them. For good, quality games, this can actually improve retail sales. Aside from that, most pirates who pirate it, like it, but never buy the full copy, would never have bought it in the first place. The latter group can be hurtful to a developer, not in terms of money, but in terms of pride. Tons of people are downloading your game for free, enjoying it, but aren't supporting you. And many of them bash it as well. I can imagine that can be a pretty big blow. Especially if the actual sales are a bit low, like 20k or so, but you see torrents with 10 times as many seeders/leechers.


I'm not sure if it's indicative of the whole community, but I don't know a single game pirate that consistently buys games they like after they pirate them. I've got a friend or two that very rarely will purchase a game they like because they decide they want to invest in the multiplayer, but by and large thieves talk a big game and then never actually spend the money because there's no reason to. While I was a PC gamer for a while and an online thief, I got to watch my favorite thing die because people like me were stealing instead of buying. These days i'm a console gamer (because PC gaming is still virtually dead) and buy new every chance I get (I live on an island, and sometimes I can only find used games) because I understand how much damage it does. That said, I know maybe 10 different people that never learned their lesson, and still pirate 19 out of 20 games they play simply because they can.


I know a few folks. There's generally more games they want to play than they can afford. So they buy the games they like the most, but pirate others. And if they really like a game they pirate, they'll buy it (though not always immediately). They probably spend more money on gaming than most consumers who are against piracy.
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#64thesnoopmeisterPosted 11/11/2012 3:36:09 AM
Comments from mature users in topics like this reassure me Gamefaqs isn't just full of spoilt brat fanboys.
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#65hyjinx17Posted 11/11/2012 3:36:42 AM
Rinton posted...
hyjinx17 posted...
Rinton posted...
hyjinx17 posted...
Its basically choosing whether to steal the game or buy it from someone you know stole it


Would it not be more accurate to say:

"Its basically choosing whether to steal the game or buy it from someone you know legitimately paid for it"

The developer already made money off of the title once via a legitimate purchase.


you call the price they give people legitimate? I call it extortion.Also, At least 35%(preferably 50) of used game sales should go to the developer. It isn't right to sell a game new, which nets the developer some cash then give customers pennies on the dollar for what they then turn around and sell it used for. It's called double dipping.


Who ever said the price was legitimate? I'm not even sure what you're referring to honestly, so I'm not sure how to respond. Are you talking about retail pricing? I mean, in all fairness developers need to make more than $60 off of each purchase to recoup costs generally. That's why most developers are switching to a DLC-heavy, online-pass, real money currency system. Developers know they can't charge more than 60 dollars a game, but costs for development are so high they have to find other ways to charge gamers more money.


I'm talking what gamestop gives people for trade-in. Just recently I was gonna trade in my 3DS, they were giving $45 while they then turn around and sell a "refurbished" model for $150, that's less then a third and Nintendo doesn't see a penny of that.
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Rainbow Dash is best pony. The only arguement I will accept is for Twilight Sparkle.
#66RintonPosted 11/11/2012 3:36:56 AM
nonexistinghero posted...
Rinton posted...
nonexistinghero posted...
Kind of a hard decision:

- Used can possibly be harder on game creators, because it encourages games stores to try to sell more used games and some stores will go pretty far with this. On the other hand, creators/publishers may be able to offer special deals with the store in the future (as in, sponsorship or events so that the stores will gain more customers).

- Pirated games are free. You aren't giving anyone any money with it. There's a decent amount of people that pirate a copy as a try-out version, then if they like it enough, they buy it. So in a way, it serves as a full-game demo for them. For good, quality games, this can actually improve retail sales. Aside from that, most pirates who pirate it, like it, but never buy the full copy, would never have bought it in the first place. The latter group can be hurtful to a developer, not in terms of money, but in terms of pride. Tons of people are downloading your game for free, enjoying it, but aren't supporting you. And many of them bash it as well. I can imagine that can be a pretty big blow. Especially if the actual sales are a bit low, like 20k or so, but you see torrents with 10 times as many seeders/leechers.


I'm not sure if it's indicative of the whole community, but I don't know a single game pirate that consistently buys games they like after they pirate them. I've got a friend or two that very rarely will purchase a game they like because they decide they want to invest in the multiplayer, but by and large thieves talk a big game and then never actually spend the money because there's no reason to. While I was a PC gamer for a while and an online thief, I got to watch my favorite thing die because people like me were stealing instead of buying. These days i'm a console gamer (because PC gaming is still virtually dead) and buy new every chance I get (I live on an island, and sometimes I can only find used games) because I understand how much damage it does. That said, I know maybe 10 different people that never learned their lesson, and still pirate 19 out of 20 games they play simply because they can.


I know a few folks. There's generally more games they want to play than they can afford. So they buy the games they like the most, but pirate others. And if they really like a game they pirate, they'll buy it (though not always immediately). They probably spend more money on gaming than most consumers who are against piracy.


I don't mean to insinuate that those gamers don't exist, I've just never met one and I know a lot of pirates. I BELIEVE they're in the minority. That said, I'm not sure there's any real way to know for sure as I don't think there's any real way to gauge. Also - and this is an assumption but - I have trouble believing that the majority of people that pirate video games would have a problem with paying less money for used games even when they do buy them. When you take into context that those buying the rare game they do like are probably still buying used, you realize that the developer is losing twice.
#67hyjinx17Posted 11/11/2012 3:37:21 AM
killak posted...
From: hyjinx17 | #058
you call the price they give people legitimate? I call it extortion.Also, At least 35%(preferably 50) of used game sales should go to the developer. It isn't right to sell a game new, which nets the developer some cash then give customers pennies on the dollar for what they then turn around and sell it used for. It's called double dipping.


What is with the insane logic on these boards?

If you buy a game, then sell it for 35 bucks, are you going to mail 25% of it to the developers?


If you sell millions of games, you can be considered a company and then yes
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Rainbow Dash is best pony. The only arguement I will accept is for Twilight Sparkle.
#68killakPosted 11/11/2012 3:39:20 AM
From: hyjinx17 | #067
If you sell millions of games, you can be considered a company and then yes


So it's not the act of profiteering of used games, but rather the amount.

You have strong convictions, I must say.
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#69RintonPosted 11/11/2012 3:40:32 AM
hyjinx17 posted...
Rinton posted...
hyjinx17 posted...
Rinton posted...
hyjinx17 posted...
Its basically choosing whether to steal the game or buy it from someone you know stole it


Would it not be more accurate to say:

"Its basically choosing whether to steal the game or buy it from someone you know legitimately paid for it"

The developer already made money off of the title once via a legitimate purchase.


you call the price they give people legitimate? I call it extortion.Also, At least 35%(preferably 50) of used game sales should go to the developer. It isn't right to sell a game new, which nets the developer some cash then give customers pennies on the dollar for what they then turn around and sell it used for. It's called double dipping.


Who ever said the price was legitimate? I'm not even sure what you're referring to honestly, so I'm not sure how to respond. Are you talking about retail pricing? I mean, in all fairness developers need to make more than $60 off of each purchase to recoup costs generally. That's why most developers are switching to a DLC-heavy, online-pass, real money currency system. Developers know they can't charge more than 60 dollars a game, but costs for development are so high they have to find other ways to charge gamers more money.


I'm talking what gamestop gives people for trade-in. Just recently I was gonna trade in my 3DS, they were giving $45 while they then turn around and sell a "refurbished" model for $150, that's less then a third and Nintendo doesn't see a penny of that.


Ah. Well, I haven't traded in a 3DS to Gamestop, but for the average new game (I generally buy new) I trade in I'll get between $25 and $35. If I but something old maybe it'll trade back at a lower price (sports game after a year or something) but generally if I'm trading a game back it's a 6 hour single player title (dishonored, for instance) that I've recently completed. Beyond that I can't comment as I don't trade in a lot of old games. My experience has been at or just under half-price, which I think is pretty fair. They're still trying to make a profit afterall.
#70AsellusPosted 11/11/2012 3:43:49 AM
Problems with your logic:

-Used games have already been purchased by 1 person and sold back to gamestop. This means that every used copy is one that the developer has already made money off of. It's not perfect, but it's better than a copy they never made a dime off of.


True but after being purchased once they can go on to be sold / resold a dozen times over. All it really takes is for enough used copies to proliferate which is why in this console era new game sales typically dry up after about two months - at that point there's enough used copies out there that stores will never need to order new copies again.

So you've got two months of regular revenue then it's all down to selling DLC and online passes. That's good, is it? It's not the way things are in pc-gaming space where there is no used game market and games have a very long sales life. It's not even the way it used to be in the console market in just the previous generation.

-Online Passes. I've never seen an online pass available to pirated copies of games. Online passes and DLC present the opportunity for developers to make sales to gamers even after they've bought used. This alone makes used copies potentially better for developers than getting robbed.

Mmm, DLC's problematic since it's usually not any more difficult to crack than the game regular but theoretically at least there's no reason you couldn't try selling online passes to pirates.