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No used games for ps4? Rumor right?

#91Jinzo 111887Posted 12/4/2012 11:53:07 PM(edited)
From: king_madden | Posted: 12/5/2012 12:33:22 AM
sighhhh, ok lets try this again.

1. i only mentioned that because he stated that if used games hurt them then they would do something to prevent it. online pass is something to help, but if they banned them completely that would lose them money from people who buy new games as well.

2. now you are comparing a broken used game, most games that are sold used are in good working condition, especially ps3 games. like i said before if you take care of your games, we all knoe a used game will be in great condition. no matter how much you take care of a used car it is still worse off than a new one. a clean used disc is just as good as a clean new one.

3. didnt the auto industry receive a bailout? how often do video game companies get that? if they dont, then this situation isnt similar and should stop being used. also like ive stated before, car companies wouldnt want anything to do with used cars since thy would be held liable for any issues which would mean a bunch of lawsuits and lost money. if you buy a used game from someone can you take it to sony and they give you you're money back?

4. and again like i said when i say hurt you guys are apparently thinking "crippling blow". its kind of like the whole "one vote counts" thing. sure just one isolated used game/vote doesnt matter, but when you add up all the instances, it matters. selling one million looks better than selling 999,999. selling 100 would look better than selling 80 with 20 bought used.

5. im going to ask you the same thing i asked riddle, what kind of evidence do you want? we all know used games arent tracked. the only people who would know either way are the devs is that not right? and you all have sat here and said you wont believe them, so what evidence do you want? who else would know if used games affected companies?

as they say, the absence of evidence is not the evidence of absence.

1.) Not sure they are allowed to do that. They may say used is copyright infringement, but it's not. Here: https://www.techdirt.com/articles/20111117/03284416803/court-tells-omega-copyright-is-not-sword-rejects-attempt-to-control-grey-market-as-copyright-misuse.shtml Company tried to use a copyrighted logo to stop unauthorized distribution of their watches.

2.) Doesn't mean everyone does. Besides, accidents do happen. A single finger print can cause a game to malfunction if it's in a bad spot.

3.) Probably only got a bailout because congressmen had stocks in those companies. Of course, it seems like that was a big mistake. If anything, that bailout should have been a loan.

4.) Which is the difference. It was blown out of proportion. While, the truth may not look pretty, but it's usually the for the best. Take Enron for example, they tried to deny/hide the truth. Didn't work too well for them.

5.) A reliable independent source without bias would be a start. Someone who's not got anything to gain from these things, but does know what's going on. Access to various companies financial statements would help, too.
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I miss the Golden Age of gaming that died in the last few years. Yeah, we got better graphics, but it's not worth recent changes if you ask me.
#92king_maddenPosted 12/5/2012 12:08:10 AM
1.) um ok, no ones arguing that.

2.) doesnt take away from the original statement which makes them not similar. ive bought numerous ps3 used games and none have had any issues.

3.) doesnt matter why they got it, they got it. again do video game devs get it? if not then they arent similar enough to compare.

4.) how do you know it was blown out of proportion. apparently none of us here know exact figures so how can you say for sure? enron....video game dev....situation arent identical, but thanks for including yet another none similar event.

5.) so you want an independant source who has knowledge of every devs and retailers money intake and from where, knows whats going into what and why, and has inside info on everything? so basically the only proof you want is from something that doesnt exist.....

so in summary we are arguing 2 sides that neither of us know for sure, im just saying any game that has fewer sales than it could possibly is affected by used games, and you are saying no thats impossible because you dont think any used sale ever means anything, and it doesnt affect the customer at all.

i asked riddle for proof on how he knows that for a fact and he just pushed it back to me not having proof. so do you have any jinzo? or are you like me and just "assuming".
#93badboyPosted 12/5/2012 12:09:56 AM
Unrealistic rumor. If this is to happen next gen, it would be Microsoft's doing.
#94crazyman32Posted 12/5/2012 12:40:46 AM
another baseless phony rumor it won't happen.
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#95Jinzo 111887Posted 12/5/2012 12:53:17 AM
From: king_madden | Posted: 12/5/2012 2:08:10 AM
1.) um ok, no ones arguing that.

2.) doesnt take away from the original statement which makes them not similar. ive bought numerous ps3 used games and none have had any issues.

3.) doesnt matter why they got it, they got it. again do video game devs get it? if not then they arent similar enough to compare.

4.) how do you know it was blown out of proportion. apparently none of us here know exact figures so how can you say for sure? enron....video game dev....situation arent identical, but thanks for including yet another none similar event.

5.) so you want an independant source who has knowledge of every devs and retailers money intake and from where, knows whats going into what and why, and has inside info on everything? so basically the only proof you want is from something that doesnt exist.....

6.)so in summary we are arguing 2 sides that neither of us know for sure, im just saying any game that has fewer sales than it could possibly is affected by used games, and you are saying no thats impossible because you dont think any used sale ever means anything, and it doesnt affect the customer at all.

i asked riddle for proof on how he knows that for a fact and he just pushed it back to me not having proof. so do you have any jinzo? or are you like me and just "assuming".


1.) Just pointing it out.
2.) Guess you never had the misfortune of having a game slip out of the case and onto the floor by accident. Yes, PS3 games are tough, but my Splatterhouse game had this happen to it. The screen goes black for a second in a hallway during the second chapter.
3.) Auto industry shouldn't have gotten it. Not for free.
4.) One lost sale isn't a big deal right? It's like a slap to the face, but you made it sound like a kick to crotch.
5.) A company's financial consultant would be a good start. I doubt every company is in danger, but the ones that are should provide access to their financial statements to prove it.
6.) Indeed we are. What I believe is that they have decided to give up on piracy and just find a new target to go after. One that might not be as damaging as what they gave up on.
7.) Statements of cash flows would shows us where their money is coming from and where its going if its detailed enough. I'd actually look into finding Sony's info myself if I get a chance since I'm going for a degree in accounting.
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I miss the Golden Age of gaming that died in the last few years. Yeah, we got better graphics, but it's not worth recent changes if you ask me.
#96king_maddenPosted 12/5/2012 1:02:44 AM
1.) oh ok got ya.
2.) thats besides the point, in your instances you are talking what "could" happen to a game if a mistake happens, or if you are careless. like i stated before, no matter how much care you take on your car, it will be nothing like new. thats why i said a well taken care of used game is just like new. a well taken care of used car is nothing like a new one. no matter how many "what if" scenarios you come up with my statement is true.
3.) again besides the point, im not arguing whether they deserved one, point is the government was willing to give them one, and a video game publisher wouldnt receive one.
4.) i dont know how i made it seem that way when i said REPEATEDLY that its not crippling but it will have an affect if its numerous people.
5.) even if it is a companies consultant, he still would have no idea how many used copies of a certain game were sold.
6.)see thats your belief and thats fine, but wouldnt it be silly to mock and name call others who believe something else. there are games that are purchased used over new, and that has an impact over final sales numbers, thats all ive said.
7. again even if you see every number sony has to give you, it still wouldnt show you how many used games were sold.
#97Jinzo 111887Posted 12/5/2012 8:00:25 AM
From: king_madden | Posted: 12/5/2012 3:02:44 AM

1.) thats besides the point, in your instances you are talking what "could" happen to a game if a mistake happens, or if you are careless. like i stated before, no matter how much care you take on your car, it will be nothing like new. thats why i said a well taken care of used game is just like new. a well taken care of used car is nothing like a new one. no matter how many "what if" scenarios you come up with my statement is true.
2.) again besides the point, im not arguing whether they deserved one, point is the government was willing to give them one, and a video game publisher wouldnt receive one.
3.) i dont know how i made it seem that way when i said REPEATEDLY that its not crippling but it will have an affect if its numerous people.
4.) even if it is a companies consultant, he still would have no idea how many used copies of a certain game were sold.
5.)see thats your belief and thats fine, but wouldnt it be silly to mock and name call others who believe something else. there are games that are purchased used over new, and that has an impact over final sales numbers, thats all ive said.
6.) again even if you see every number sony has to give you, it still wouldnt show you how many used games were sold.

1.)Of course. That doesn't they can't get broken, scratched, etc.
2.)And if local game companies asked for bailouts back before they were abused, they might have gotten bailed out. Of course, I am not sure Congress didn't just make it a loan instead. Would have made it so they understand that they have to make an effort to turn their situation around.
3.)You could have been more specific about the damage. One lost sale is just a slap in the face. (Hardly any damage) If a lot of people bought used, that would be a punch to the gut. (Painful, but not as bad as it can be.) If everybody pirated the game (since it's not possible for everybody to buy used since someone has to buy it new first in order for it to be used), it would be a chainsaw massacre.
4.)No, but it would reveal if they were in financial trouble or not. Which would reveal if they really need online passes or are just playing make believe with disaster scenarios involving their company. Sony's credit rating being downgraded might be a sign they are in trouble, but where they in that same trouble when they started using them? Of course, it's not like Sony couldn't go the Sega way next gen.
5.)I never said they were "fine," just that I believe piracy is where they are really losing money and they had given up on it. We don't know how much they are losing to either one. Who's to say for sure it's not pirates who are doing the real damage?
6.)Like I said, knowing that info would reveal if they are in trouble or not, what stuff they might want to cut out of their budget, etc.
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#98king_maddenPosted 12/5/2012 6:42:06 PM
1.) yes anything can happen. point still remains, if you take care of a used game it can be just like a brand new game, even if you take care of a used car its still nothing like a brand new one.

2.) you dont know that, they have no reason to bail them out, cars are much more vital to an economy than video games.

3.) i was always specific, i always said its not crippling just for a few, but there is a difference. it can make an affect if its a lot. i said that repeatedly you guys choose to ignore that part.

4.) so all the companies going out of business, reporting losses, laying off people and closing locations isnt an indication of being in financial trouble?

5.) pirates may be doing the "real" damage, but that has nothing to do with what im saying. all i said is used games can potentially have an affect in games sold or in bottom line, thats all. its not much they can do for pirates, everything has been hacked in some way, there isnt much they CAN do, other than monitor their servers.

6.)they have been cutting employees, offices, projects, and branches i think that shows a few companies are in financial trouble.
#99riddlebox89Posted 12/5/2012 7:12:11 PM
king_madden posted...
Your extremely weak "disses" really highlight the immaturity. And your simple logic here helps the issue lol. Anyway, did you really just say sony would implement a way so used games didn't hurt them as much? That's what online pass is for.

I don't know what kind of proof you want, used sales aren't tracked, gamestop won't come out and admit they might be hurting devs, and when devs say it is hurting you dismiss it as they are just money hungry. Side note, can you be a greedy money hungry business that's losing money? I thought you were only greedy if you were making more than enough to thrive, yet many publishers are losing money.

Lmao I'm sorry but using profanity on a video game message board isn't growing a pair or manning up, lol just proves immaturity. Dude literally said man up ina video game discussion. Lol log off.

Let me know what kind of proof you want? Devs have said it, if one sale is lost that hurts again nothing major but could have an affect. If you don't think something having fewer sales doesn't hurt then I dnt know what to tell u.


Lol, online passes, that's not something one does when they want to put a stop to used game sales, especially when you can buy a game used for $20, then buy the online pass on ebay for $5, and even if you don't find one on ebay, they're still readily available on the PSN store for $10 to $15, which means you can still buy the game used and get the online pass. Online passes doesn't do jack s*** to stop used sales, hell if anything, they merely suggest buying new so you'd get the online pass, but what if one doesn't care for online modes? They have no reason not to buy used, and they can also buy new and sell the online pass since they have every right to do so.

*deletes used car/game vs new car/game part because you clearly don't grasp simple logic*

Gee maybe a link that shows at least one time where used sales hurt the sales of a brand new game? Seriously, you act so smart but you didn't think of this on your own?

And why would Gamestop say used sales is hurting devs? It's not, simple fact.

Also, you're getting confused here, it's not the developers complaining that used sales are hurting them, it's the publishers, and guess what? So far all they've done is say "used sales is hurting us!" without providing any proof to the claim, which leads me to say this, just because publishers say something is hurting them, doesn't make it true.

And saying lol after every word in a sentence, as well as using text speak isn't a sign of immaturity? Grow up kid, if people cursing bothers you so much, clearly you're the one who should be logging off, so I say again, grow a pair.

Devs have not said it, as I've already said, it's the publishers who are getting their panties in a bunch over it. And you're forgetting one very basic thing, the games have already been paid for before they're even on store shelves, every copy was bought by the retailer, which the consumer pays, not the devs/publishers, the copies have been paid for, no profits are lost as they already have their money and are not entitled to anything past that.

There is absolutely NOTHING that suggests that used sales actually hurts them, and you're nothing less than a fool for reading "used sales hurt us!" and believing it right then and there without seeing any proof to support that claim.
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#100king_maddenPosted 12/5/2012 8:53:19 PM
lol this guy again. oh well got in a semi intelligent conversation before he came back.

ok again, no where did i say online pass was to stop used games, I said they are to help soften the blow of used games. go on show me where i said online pass was used to "stop" used sales......

glad you finally let that ridiculous used car analogy go.

again used game sales arent tracked, we all know used games are being purchased, so again if a game was bought used instead of new just one time, a games total sales number is decreased. last time i checked more is better than less.

if publishers are complaining its going to affect devs, because publishers are usually funding dev projects.

lol grow a pair on a video game board. cracks me up everytime.

again we arent talking about whats already been paid for or whats already purchased. if a publisher gives a dev money to make a game, they have goals to meet and certain sales goals to reach. if that sales goal is lower than they like, they can pull projects, decrease money, or drop the company altogether. thats why i say it can hurt eventually. yes they already got paid, but if they dont see good sales numebrs, or good reaction that will hurt the dev in the future.

true or false, publishers would be more willing to support and give more money to a company that sales more games right? if more used games were purchased new that would raise the number of games sold correct?

publishers dont just hand them money and then ignore how much they actually sell.