This is a split board - You can return to the Split List for other boards.

Honestly FF7 gets a lot of hate for being overrated (spoilers)

#71wrightreyesrockPosted 2/12/2013 9:37:19 AM
If I didn't know any better I would think Final Fantasy VII is terrible. I see way more people hating it than loving it here so I don't see how it can be overrated. More like underrated
#72darkphoenix181Posted 2/12/2013 12:06:19 PM
Fungum posted...
darkphoenix181 posted...
FF1 kept Square in business. FF7 put Square's name on the map and made them the big video game company. That alone tells you how good of a game it was. Infact, the impact of 7 was so huge that they can still muster out sales based on the name Final Fantasy despite the recent ones not being worthy of the name.

Oh you like FFX and think it is the best? Thank FF7 for giving Square the budget to create it. Thanks FF6 for giving Square the budget to make FF7


Had nothing to do with the $100m they spent back in 1997 on marketing. Nope.

None of your points really hold any merit. FF7 revolutionized nothing.

Long string of useless fanboy bias opinions hating on FF7



This is funny. Spending money on marketing always works right? I mean, spending 100m on marketing makes a bad game like FF7 instantly popular and sell like crazy amirite?
You have no idea how stupid your post is because you are the one who wrote it. I pity you, I really do.
---
Megaman Legends 3 :( NOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1
#73ZignoffPosted 2/12/2013 12:09:42 PM
FF9 was better in almost every aspect, plus actually had a well done and conclusive ENDING 15 minute long one to be exact...
---
Here comes a New Web Comic for gamers, BY a gamer, Critique is welcomed as long as you are positive about it.
http://hatetheplayer.thewebcomic.com/
#74RPG maniac87Posted 2/12/2013 12:14:14 PM
It's all relative. Final Fantasy's fanbase is massive. It may seem like a lot, but the entirety of these forums is just a drop in the bucket compared to the full fanbase.
---
You lack the mustache for full comprehension. (Super Paper Mario)
#75king_maddenPosted 2/12/2013 12:14:57 PM
Astroshak posted...
king_madden posted...
@Astroshak

now if you sit and name everything that made it not the best for you, it is all according to YOUR opinion. as soon as the next person disagrees, you cancel each others opinion out. like i said, the only way to judge what can be considered the best in gaming, is sales, longevity, and reviews. Anything pertaining to story, graphics, setting, or anything else, are all just your personal opinions.


Of COURSE it is personal opinion! I have been saying that all along.

But, no, running into someone who has a different opinion does NOT automatically have our opinions cancel each other out. They both are still fully valid. They just do not happen to agree with one another. Consensus is NOT a requirement.

The whole idea of what game is best is only a matter of opinion. If I say a game is great, and you think it is merely mediocre, then as far as you are concerned, I am overrating it. Neither opinion is invalidated by the other.

All you are doing is setting different criteria for what you consider to be best. Criteria I obviously disagree with. Are our opinions both then invalidated? Not one bit.

Best Selling does not mean Best Game; it merely means Best Selling. Reviews and longevity are merely opinions, as well. I think that a lot of people are overlooking that. Because Some_Game_Magazine_Reviewer gives a game good review or bad does not make the game good or bad, it is merely that reviewer's opinion. I'm dismayed that people still pay attention to reviews, without any real regard for who is giving the review, but they do, all over the place, not just in gaming.



you are trying to break it down too far, according to you nothing anywhere should be labelled the best because its all just opinions. while thats partially true, in the gaming industry something can be called the best if its at the top of everything. you cant take things like personal opinion on the game and have them factor in because they DO cancel each other out. if we were debating milk and I said i like it and you didnt, that would be a dead lock, so they would have to ask more people until one is more than the other to determine that milk is preferred. thats why they cancel each other out.

as for games, you look at sales longevity, reviews, and sales. when a game has all 3 of those, it can be regarded as the best. it was looked upon favorably by most, it has held up over time, and sold more than any other. longevity isnt an opinion, you cant say "well this music piece has been loved since the 1800s", and then turn around and say well thats your opinion. its not a personal opinion when it stands over time, you can look and see for yourself, even if you dont like the game you can see it sold well in 97, and sold well when it came out again in what like 2008 or whatever it was, even if you had the game you can see its lasted through time.

I just dont see how something can have just as many good reviews as anything else, still played just as much as anything else, and sell much more than anything else. (anything else being other FF games), but you still yell opinion to fight the distinction. "Best Game" is an opinion term, so majority rules out.
#76ZiggletoothPosted 2/13/2013 10:55:38 PM
* astroshak says

I did not mention philosophy. I said you sound like someone who had taken a college course and was impressed with a new way to use a term you had just discovered. If you want to call an observation like that "mud slinging" then feel free - though it was meant to help you get your point across so most people here would understand what you are saying, not just 0.5% of the readers. If people do not understand what you are saying, there is no value in having said it and you have not advanced your cause at all.

-> lol how is stating that I use a term just because I have just learned a new way to use it not a derogatory statement?

yes mudslinging


* astroshak says

Best is merely a matter of opinion. Are you saying that just due to having more people around expressing an opinion makes it somehow more right than a dissenting opinion? A lot of people believed that the Earth was flat, until shown empirical proof that it is not - was that majority opinion "the best?"

-> I have already explained this, and you did not make any objection at the time. As I have already said saying something is the best is a factual statement. If you did not believe in an objective meaning you should of said in my opinion, or in my view, or my preference. you did not do this you said a is b.

now you are trying to go backwards to avoid your obvious failing by trying to remove yourself from naturalism - something you went a long with for many posts. but as I have said, your original statement implies that position. so you can't without admitting that your statement that a is the best was a mistake.

* astroshak says

I would indeed say, and have said, that story is more important for an RPG than graphics are. Best is merely a matter of opinion, which is why the debate on it is endless.

And FWIW, if someone said "this is the best apple" I would take it in context - if they are talking about baking apple pies, that is a different matter than talking about eating raw. Some apples are crisper than others, some hold up to the heat better than others, and some work well with other types of apple to produce a superior apple pie.

-> if we are talking about objectivity, the definition of best must remain the same. you doing this because you believe abandoning naturalism now will enable you to escape. as I have said that would mean your comment of the best would be a mistake.

a utilitarian would say the best apple is whatever apple has the greatest benefit to society. a aristotilian virtue ethicist would say whatever apple is most true to the virtues that make it an apple.

* astroshak says

As I said, "best" is a matter of opinion. The only way to change it from subjective to objective is to distill it. If you are looking at "best selling" then you can look at objective sales figures. If you are looking at "best" then it includes all those subjective things you want to exclude from it.

-> again you are using your anti-realist escape route.
---
He feared that his home should appear to Gods and men.
Dreadful, dank and hated even by the Gods. Hades -Iliad 20.64-65
#77ZiggletoothPosted 2/13/2013 10:56:06 PM
* astroshak says

Not at all. I think that "best" is a subjective term, that is all.

-> and again

* astroshak says

I did not say what was best. I said that FF7 is not the best. Fairly big difference there. I also said what some of my criteria for "best game" are. Obviously, yours differ - which means that of course we would have different ideas as to what the "best game" is.

I do not consider a popularity contest anything at all close to an indicator as to what "best" is. If you do, then we have a disagreement. If you are not interested in converting dissenting people to your view, why participate in a discussion?

-> no difference, a is the best or a is not the best both assert the property of best exists. If there are only opinions then the property doesnt exist so why are you declaring it so?

because I am interested in other people and myself finding the truth. you take the view arguments are just to get others to accept your view I take the position of socrates here, that if I have failed then I come out best because I have learned something. it's not a competition, it's about answers.

* astroshak says

For the same reason anyone else does, or that you would expect anyone to pay attention to you. You and I are both members of society. As such we both have the so-called "right to be heard" - not a Consitutionally granted right, but implied by the right to free speech. And frankly, I doubt that society in general cares one bit whatever individuals happen to think is "best" when it comes to games. Individuals clearly do, as you and I both demonstrate, but society at large? Nope.

Your problem is you are trying to shorten "best sales" or "best popularity" into "best" ... and there are entirely too many other things for a game to be best at.

-> oh boy, are you gonna jump to the philosophy of rights and duties now? I am not american for a start so the constitution which is highly fallable doesnt even apply to me.

and your reasoning not to be concise and accurate is because society doesn't care? thats an immediately contradiction to what you just said about trying to change other people opinions as a point for argument

I didnt say sales at all. I said whatever society thinks is best is the only reasonable definition for calling something the best. if you said this is the best for me my definition would be what game you think is the best and by best, most agreeable to you.
---
He feared that his home should appear to Gods and men.
Dreadful, dank and hated even by the Gods. Hades -Iliad 20.64-65