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Why do people compare used games to piracy?.

#101king_maddenPosted 4/29/2013 5:03:50 PM
riddlebox89 posted...
chiefofsb78 posted...
Because the devs doesnt gets paid for neither and its killing gaming


And? Even if there was no used game sales or piracy, devs wouldn't get CoD sales anyway, they'd get the same sales numbers regardless of whether used game sales existed or not, and besides, it's not killing gaming.

chiefofsb78 posted...
Its not killing gaming tell that to the devs that go out of business every year and you cant compare cars to $60 games cars are way over priced car companies are getting way more than enough money so they dont care about used care sales


Oh you mean the publishers that just say "Used games are hurting us!" but provide absolutely no proof? Seriously go out and show me some factual evidence that used games are really hurting the industry.

Do you even know why they've started saying that used games are "hurting" them? It's because of greed, they see that people can buy quite a few games used at a significantly lower price (most of the time) and they decide that they're no longer happy with gaining profits from retailers ordering shipments from them and the small percentage they get from each individual sale, they want every penny that one copy of the game makes, which by law they are not entitled to because once you buy the game in the store, it's legally yours, you own it and can do whatever you want with it, which includes selling it.

Lol and? It's still a product that was legally bought by a consumer and is being sold used.

And I have never once seen a publisher/developer go out of business because of used sales.

Buying used games doesn't hurt a goddamned thing.



riddlebox is always good for the "show me proof its hurting the industry". even though no one here can provide facts or proof that say they are not hurting the industry. I will say this though, we can go into any gamestop and see just about every day someone go in there and buy a used game over new JUST because its cheaper. if you would buy new if there wasnt any used then thats a lost sale, and thats all the devs complain about.

riddlebox if your saving grace to your argument is SHOW ME PROOF, does that mean that devs can say SHOW US PROOF IT ISNT HURTING, and nullify your argument?

they only people who would know are devs because they can track trophy support and get a good idea as to how many games were played against how many were actually sold, but of course none of you would believe them even if they provided proof so i dont know why you're even asking for it.
#102justchill433Posted 4/29/2013 6:48:35 PM(edited)
Do you even know why they've started saying that used games are "hurting" them? It's because of greed, they see that people can buy quite a few games used at a significantly lower price (most of the time) and they decide that they're no longer happy with gaining profits from retailers ordering shipments from them and the small percentage they get from each individual sale, they want every penny that one copy of the game makes, which by law they are not entitled to because once you buy the game in the store, it's legally yours, you own it and can do whatever you want with it, which includes selling it.

Or you know it could be that devs aren't making money, in fact some are losing money as evidenced by the massive amounts of companies that are financially struggling/going under (I believe that could be considered some proof).
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#103PStrifePosted 4/29/2013 7:28:32 PM
Companies go bankrupt or get liquidated every generation, just cause you can notice it these days thanks to internet does not mean it has now increased. Everything is being exaggerated in so many ways by the industry people looking for more money and less benefits to you.
#104Caer_DeathPosted 4/29/2013 7:35:50 PM
king_madden posted...
riddlebox89 posted...
chiefofsb78 posted...
Because the devs doesnt gets paid for neither and its killing gaming


And? Even if there was no used game sales or piracy, devs wouldn't get CoD sales anyway, they'd get the same sales numbers regardless of whether used game sales existed or not, and besides, it's not killing gaming.

chiefofsb78 posted...
Its not killing gaming tell that to the devs that go out of business every year and you cant compare cars to $60 games cars are way over priced car companies are getting way more than enough money so they dont care about used care sales


Oh you mean the publishers that just say "Used games are hurting us!" but provide absolutely no proof? Seriously go out and show me some factual evidence that used games are really hurting the industry.

Do you even know why they've started saying that used games are "hurting" them? It's because of greed, they see that people can buy quite a few games used at a significantly lower price (most of the time) and they decide that they're no longer happy with gaining profits from retailers ordering shipments from them and the small percentage they get from each individual sale, they want every penny that one copy of the game makes, which by law they are not entitled to because once you buy the game in the store, it's legally yours, you own it and can do whatever you want with it, which includes selling it.

Lol and? It's still a product that was legally bought by a consumer and is being sold used.

And I have never once seen a publisher/developer go out of business because of used sales.

Buying used games doesn't hurt a goddamned thing.



riddlebox is always good for the "show me proof its hurting the industry". even though no one here can provide facts or proof that say they are not hurting the industry. I will say this though, we can go into any gamestop and see just about every day someone go in there and buy a used game over new JUST because its cheaper. if you would buy new if there wasnt any used then thats a lost sale, and thats all the devs complain about.

riddlebox if your saving grace to your argument is SHOW ME PROOF, does that mean that devs can say SHOW US PROOF IT ISNT HURTING, and nullify your argument?

they only people who would know are devs because they can track trophy support and get a good idea as to how many games were played against how many were actually sold, but of course none of you would believe them even if they provided proof so i dont know why you're even asking for it.


1. And you're here to tell them that those consumers don't know how to make the right choices. Selfish gamers.

2. Trophies are a terrible way to track how much a company lost to used game sales. With the way saving works on the PS3, most people that use it have their own personal account, and often times when multiple people in the same house share a console, they share games for that console. One of the perks to buying a game that multiple people would enjoy is that multiple people get enjoyment out of it and make it more worth the cost.
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#105marvelite50Posted 4/29/2013 7:59:55 PM
People talk about developers that have gone under due to used sales, can anyone name a developer that made quality games that people wanted to buy and was put under by used sales? Good games make money. Good franchises make money. If you don't have either of those, you should think twice before dropping millions into a game that just isn't that good. Poor investments on the corporate side of the market are what is really hurting the industry. They expect COD level sales without thinking that COD didn't start out with the kind of sales it has now. It built up it's franchise name by making quality games that the customers wanted to buy.

It's important to note that COD started off this gen relatively unique (with MW). Many other games try and emulate COD and fail, because they are competing against something that is already the king of the genre. Why would you buy a COD clone when you could just buy COD? The way you build a franchise is by starting something relatively unique. Assassins creed is a good example.

The game industry seems to be incapable of accurately predicting the number of sales they can expect, which is 100% their fault if they're taking losses. The film industry is extremely good at predicting sales, and even when you do have a big budget movie that flops, more times that not it still makes it's money back. If the game industry is frequently taking losses on games, that's their own fault for not being smart with their money.
#106king_maddenPosted 4/29/2013 8:09:15 PM
1. im not even sure what point you're trying to make since nothing you said matches anything I said.

2. trophies is one way, as well as online passes, of course depending on the game. im sure they arent just saying "we're going to solely use trophies to figure it out. they probably use more information as well as trophies to tell a number of things. as we all know used games sales arent tracked by anyone, so they can only ball park it.
#107king_maddenPosted 4/29/2013 8:12:47 PM
marvelite50 posted...
People talk about developers that have gone under due to used sales, can anyone name a developer that made quality games that people wanted to buy and was put under by used sales? Good games make money. Good franchises make money. If you don't have either of those, you should think twice before dropping millions into a game that just isn't that good. Poor investments on the corporate side of the market are what is really hurting the industry. They expect COD level sales without thinking that COD didn't start out with the kind of sales it has now. It built up it's franchise name by making quality games that the customers wanted to buy.

It's important to note that COD started off this gen relatively unique (with MW). Many other games try and emulate COD and fail, because they are competing against something that is already the king of the genre. Why would you buy a COD clone when you could just buy COD? The way you build a franchise is by starting something relatively unique. Assassins creed is a good example.

The game industry seems to be incapable of accurately predicting the number of sales they can expect, which is 100% their fault if they're taking losses. The film industry is extremely good at predicting sales, and even when you do have a big budget movie that flops, more times that not it still makes it's money back. If the game industry is frequently taking losses on games, that's their own fault for not being smart with their money.



there are good games that sale, there are good games that dont sell. there are "bad games" that sell, and bad games that dont sell.

there are also A LOT of movies that make no where near their costs back, not sure where you're getting that. Companies want to put money behind things they think will work, sometimes it works, sometimes it doesnt, you never really know, its all a gamble. there is nothing out there that is 100% at predicting what will sell and what wouldnt.
#108koalabear9000Posted 4/29/2013 11:15:20 PM
king_madden posted...
marvelite50 posted...
People talk about developers that have gone under due to used sales, can anyone name a developer that made quality games that people wanted to buy and was put under by used sales? Good games make money. Good franchises make money. If you don't have either of those, you should think twice before dropping millions into a game that just isn't that good. Poor investments on the corporate side of the market are what is really hurting the industry. They expect COD level sales without thinking that COD didn't start out with the kind of sales it has now. It built up it's franchise name by making quality games that the customers wanted to buy.

It's important to note that COD started off this gen relatively unique (with MW). Many other games try and emulate COD and fail, because they are competing against something that is already the king of the genre. Why would you buy a COD clone when you could just buy COD? The way you build a franchise is by starting something relatively unique. Assassins creed is a good example.

The game industry seems to be incapable of accurately predicting the number of sales they can expect, which is 100% their fault if they're taking losses. The film industry is extremely good at predicting sales, and even when you do have a big budget movie that flops, more times that not it still makes it's money back. If the game industry is frequently taking losses on games, that's their own fault for not being smart with their money.



there are good games that sale, there are good games that dont sell. there are "bad games" that sell, and bad games that dont sell.

there are also A LOT of movies that make no where near their costs back, not sure where you're getting that. Companies want to put money behind things they think will work, sometimes it works, sometimes it doesnt, you never really know, its all a gamble. there is nothing out there that is 100% at predicting what will sell and what wouldnt.


But companies could put lot less money in games and that way minimize the potential risk and same time maximize the potential profit. I agree that there is no way to be certain if something sells or not but it is stupid to think that everything will sell like CoD and put ridiculous amounts of money towards a product that only a handful of people are going to buy.

When you look at it used game sale is hurting the industry but that's only because publishers expect sales that wouldn't even happen. If used games would be banned it wouldn't increase anymore sales because then those people who buy used would just wait the price to go down and that is equally bad for publisher.
#109Lord_Shadow_19Posted 4/30/2013 4:35:27 PM
koalabear9000 posted...
king_madden posted...
marvelite50 posted...
People talk about developers that have gone under due to used sales, can anyone name a developer that made quality games that people wanted to buy and was put under by used sales? Good games make money. Good franchises make money. If you don't have either of those, you should think twice before dropping millions into a game that just isn't that good. Poor investments on the corporate side of the market are what is really hurting the industry. They expect COD level sales without thinking that COD didn't start out with the kind of sales it has now. It built up it's franchise name by making quality games that the customers wanted to buy.

It's important to note that COD started off this gen relatively unique (with MW). Many other games try and emulate COD and fail, because they are competing against something that is already the king of the genre. Why would you buy a COD clone when you could just buy COD? The way you build a franchise is by starting something relatively unique. Assassins creed is a good example.

The game industry seems to be incapable of accurately predicting the number of sales they can expect, which is 100% their fault if they're taking losses. The film industry is extremely good at predicting sales, and even when you do have a big budget movie that flops, more times that not it still makes it's money back. If the game industry is frequently taking losses on games, that's their own fault for not being smart with their money.



there are good games that sale, there are good games that dont sell. there are "bad games" that sell, and bad games that dont sell.

there are also A LOT of movies that make no where near their costs back, not sure where you're getting that. Companies want to put money behind things they think will work, sometimes it works, sometimes it doesnt, you never really know, its all a gamble. there is nothing out there that is 100% at predicting what will sell and what wouldnt.


But companies could put lot less money in games and that way minimize the potential risk and same time maximize the potential profit. I agree that there is no way to be certain if something sells or not but it is stupid to think that everything will sell like CoD and put ridiculous amounts of money towards a product that only a handful of people are going to buy.

When you look at it used game sale is hurting the industry but that's only because publishers expect sales that wouldn't even happen. If used games would be banned it wouldn't increase anymore sales because then those people who buy used would just wait the price to go down and that is equally bad for publisher.


So you want you companies to put LESS effort into making games, I may be old fashioned, but I want games to continue improving.
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#110kingstagPosted 4/30/2013 5:34:20 PM
I use used game purchases to reward/punish publishers. I refuse to buy new games from Capcom and EA. The Souls games I bought full price.

Also, if something has DLC announced ahead of time I never buy new. I wait until it's used to offset the price of the the DLC. The more DLC the longer I wait to buy used. I have a bunch of games to keep me busy in the meantime and lots of patience.

If the games is poor (or from Capcom or EA) I put it right back into the used market as soon as I'm finished -- hopefully taking another sale away from the publisher.

I really dislike Capcom and EA.