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I'm kinda glad the new entries of Final Fantasy aren't turn based

#51agrissaPosted 7/29/2013 4:14:54 PM
You know JRPGs are dead when even Final Fantasy is getting CoD-fied.
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DMC>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>DmC
#52656stoogePosted 7/29/2013 9:44:04 PM
Saying games with ATB are not turn based is ridiculous.

Ever played the card game UNO? It's a card game where each player takes turns to play a card from their hands, and yet each players turn can be skipped or reversed over. You're still taking turns putting cards down, but the process isn't entirely linear.

Same goes with the ATB system. If you put the game in wait mode you can the sit their when it's your characters turn to attack and nothing will happen. Setting it to active is still the same thing, except now an enemy can override your turn if you're not fast enough. You still can't attack until it's your turn and your ATB gauge is full though, and neither can they.
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For want of the price of tea and a slice, the old man died.
#53SinfullyvannilaPosted 7/30/2013 6:42:24 AM(edited)
656stooge posted...
Saying games with ATB are not turn based is ridiculous.

Ever played the card game UNO? It's a card game where each player takes turns to play a card from their hands, and yet each players turn can be skipped or reversed over. You're still taking turns putting cards down, but the process isn't entirely linear.

Same goes with the ATB system. If you put the game in wait mode you can the sit their when it's your characters turn to attack and nothing will happen. Setting it to active is still the same thing, except now an enemy can override your turn if you're not fast enough. You still can't attack until it's your turn and your ATB gauge is full though, and neither can they.


The turn order can be manipulated by action cards. This is a terrible analogy for comparison. People don't lose priority when their turn is skipped. They are not granted priority because of an event that took place on another turn. This is unlike ATB, because in ATB, there is no concept of priority under any circumstance.

Also, "Wait" wasn't originally part of ATB.
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Also, Chess is a game of skill much like all gameplay only video games. So it is pretty mindless if you think about it.-mtjormitch
#54656stoogePosted 7/30/2013 8:16:22 AM
Sinfullyvannila posted...

The turn order can be manipulated by action cards. This is a terrible analogy for comparison. People don't lose priority when their turn is skipped. They are not granted priority because of an event that took place on another turn. This is unlike ATB, because in ATB, there is no concept of priority under any circumstance.

Also, "Wait" wasn't originally part of ATB.


Explain how the ATB system is any different than a turn based one then?

In traditional turn based, like in FFX for example, characters can have multiple attacks before an enemy is granted a turn. How is that any different than a character being able to attack multiple times in an ATB system because they're ATB gauge fills faster? The enemies still have to wait before attacking, and vice Versa if the player character is slower than the enemy.

All the ATB system does is gives some visual idea of why it's each characters turn to attack.
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For want of the price of tea and a slice, the old man died.
#55SinfullyvannilaPosted 7/30/2013 8:25:40 AM(edited)
656stooge posted...
Sinfullyvannila posted...

The turn order can be manipulated by action cards. This is a terrible analogy for comparison. People don't lose priority when their turn is skipped. They are not granted priority because of an event that took place on another turn. This is unlike ATB, because in ATB, there is no concept of priority under any circumstance.

Also, "Wait" wasn't originally part of ATB.


Explain how the ATB system is any different than a turn based one then?

In traditional turn based, like in FFX for example, characters can have multiple attacks before an enemy is granted a turn. How is that any different than a character being able to attack multiple times in an ATB system because they're ATB gauge fills faster? The enemies still have to wait before attacking, and vice Versa if the player character is slower than the enemy.

All the ATB system does is gives some visual idea of why it's each characters turn to attack.


Priority is not something in the future, it is something in the present, it's the right to initiate action. It has very little to do with turn order. Turn order only marks when someone gains priority. In FF10, the turn order can change, but once your turn comes up, you have priority.
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Also, Chess is a game of skill much like all gameplay only video games. So it is pretty mindless if you think about it.-mtjormitch
#56656stoogePosted 7/30/2013 8:36:38 AM
So does an ATB system set to 'wait'.
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For want of the price of tea and a slice, the old man died.
#57SinfullyvannilaPosted 7/30/2013 8:38:36 AM
656stooge posted...
So does an ATB system set to 'wait'.


But wait isn't part of ATB. It's an option that came in subsequent games

The other option is Active, which is the "A" in ATB.

If you are play Wait, you aren't playing ATB.
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Also, Chess is a game of skill much like all gameplay only video games. So it is pretty mindless if you think about it.-mtjormitch
#58656stoogePosted 7/30/2013 8:41:04 AM
Why are you bringing up that it wasn't an original option? It has been for as long as I can remember, so that argument is moot.
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For want of the price of tea and a slice, the old man died.
#59SinfullyvannilaPosted 7/30/2013 8:47:55 AM(edited)
656stooge posted...
Why are you bringing up that it wasn't an original option? It has been for as long as I can remember, so that argument is moot.


It wasn't in 4. 4 is the original ATB. It isn't an intrinsic part of ATB. Wait is intrinsically not Active. ATB is intrinsically active.

Hence, Wait is not ATB.

When 4 came out, people were like "holy ****, it's an rpg that isn't turn-based".

Calling it moot because you don't remember it is absurd.
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Also, Chess is a game of skill much like all gameplay only video games. So it is pretty mindless if you think about it.-mtjormitch
#60chaosAD2005Posted 7/30/2013 9:10:16 AM
namethatno1uses posted...
Bissomoneybags posted...
playing through IX

There's the problem. IX's battles are horribly slow compared to the rest of the series.


FFVIII and the draw/GF summon system would like to have a word with you with how slow the battles were and FFIX was actually the fastest ATB system in all Pre FFX games hell you could even disable the summon animations if you wanted to.

Just saying if you don't know what the hell you're talking about just don't say anything.
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klatu verata nik... oh wait what was the rest?