Unbeatable Team Build

#1AdasheePosted 11/22/2012 5:33:44 AM(edited)
I messed around with my old save recently and would like to see some good feedback. Since this game story mode is stupid easy with many abusable builds that can plow though the game regardless, my ideal setup is intended to be unbeatable in Melee (PvP).

I tested parties comprised of Level up/down units (best possible stats), and also with those started from a level 1 Onion Knight to level 99 (best without Lv.up/down "yes, I am that obsessed about this game").

All unit are Female level 99, with Brave 97 and Faith 03.
Jobs: 3 Ninjas and 2 Dark Knight (or vice-visa).


Dark Knight

Darkness
Speechcraft
Firststrike or Earplug
Safeguard
Teleport or Move + 3

Excalibur (or Chaos Blade if wearing Tynar Rouge or Brigand's Gloves)
Escutcheon II or Reverie Shield
Ribbon
Grand Armor
Tynar Rouge or Brigand's Gloves (Gaius Caligae if equip with Excalibur.)



Ninja

Throw
Art of War
Firststrike or Earplug
Safeguard
Teleport or Move + 3

Orochi
Orochi
Ribbon
Brave Suit
Brigand's Gloves


This setup's goal is not to attack for damage, but instead to the speed stat and bravery. Taking account that both players have access to the game's entire inventory, doing damage is unimportant due to many equipment that grants permanent re-raise. The likely hood of pinning down and strike all opponents before re-raise is unlikely with units with high speeds, flexible movement, constant Haste and Regen, and units being spread out.

The strategy is to have the ninjas use speed rend while the Dark Knights use Intimidate to lower bravery. 'Hit and Run' until all opponents becomes a chicken due to the lowered bravery. Once the are chicken, continue using speed rend (easier since they no longer have a reaction skill) until their speed is 1. Once opponents are slow as hell, just kill them since they can not auto-revive in time.

My choice in reaction ability are counter-measures against my own game-plan. Shirahadori, is great and all, but It can not protect against duel-wielded Art of War like First strike does. Earplugs protect your all-important bravery and speed stats. The Orochi give Ninjas a way to heal other than regen (Undead opponents are unlikely and otherwise does not thwart this tactic since ninja can kill with Throw if need be.)

Yes this team build and strategy is BORING... but, IMO, it is UNBEATABLE assuming units are properly spaced and not played carelessly. If you think you have a better team build the can beat this, I like to hear.
#2terran3999999Posted 11/22/2012 12:43:10 PM
Daamn, I must say this is thought out very well. But wouldn't using Sing? be better? You can reduce their speed but you also won't need to bother with getting in range and it actually allows you to stall a bit by running around.
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#3Adashee(Topic Creator)Posted 11/22/2012 1:51:06 PM(edited)
Thanks for your compliment.

I'm assuming you mean dance right, lol. Dance can work, assuming everyone has it as a sub, but from my testing I found it to be not as reliable or fast. Since if the dancer is killed mid-dance, you'll waste the turn auto-revive and have to start the dance again. Also, haste does nothing to speed up the dance action, so you'll get more turns by using ArtofWar instead. Sure it can hit everyone, anywhere, but it also has a 50% hit rates, and only subtract 1 speed point per hit.

An ArtofWar ninja, on the other hand, can hit at 3 speed point per hit and you have 2 attempts per turn. While as long as the opponent has Shirahadori, it will block your first attempt, however as the character's bravery lowers (and once chicken), lowering 6 speed a turn is easy.

The idea is to focus on one unit at a time. A unit that is chicken with only 1 speed is essentially dead, so you then move to your next target. Your opponent of course will quickly understand what's going on, but can not do anything about it.

I remember testing this with a someone that also claimed a unbeatable build. I laughed when I saw all unit with Mana Shield/font combo, lol. After 2 chicken, he quickly rage quit and call me a cheap bastard or something, LOL.
#4aerisfanboyPosted 11/23/2012 1:59:29 AM
With or without Math Skill? o.O
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#5vegetakenPosted 11/23/2012 3:53:33 PM
Don't they not allow math skill in melee? I haven't ever fought anyone but I thought a few things were not allowed.

Btw neat concept...trying to think of some sort of max speed counter lol.
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#6Adashee(Topic Creator)Posted 11/23/2012 7:57:59 PM
aerisfanboy posted...
With or without Math Skill? o.O


In melee players has the option to disable Match skill/Arithmeticks or not. Regardless, due to the teams low faith, all magic attack are largely ineffective........ with the exception of Quickening.

Yes, quickening can beat this team....... but it depends. If this is a battle with standard leveled units, then the Quickening team will win, assuming its equiped to outspeed the ninja's. However if it's a Maxed-Out stat battle, then the outcome may be decided who is "first" player and what map is used. First player wins on Speed ties and since the Ninja are configured to move 7 spaces, depending on the map, they can move in and throw to kill a mage. Since Quickening is depending on premeditated pattern, killing Mage 1 or 2 will disrupt their attempt to get the Quickening started. Also a quickening shouldn't have any auto-revive equipment since all such equipment is paired with regen as well (it messes with Critical Quick setup.)

As long as the ninja can Throw (and not miss) and kill a single mage before the Quicken team takes a turn, you can win. I have never tested this though, and this is all based on theory-concept. But because both players need to consent to the rules before the match, all this can be avoided, lol.


I've been thinking up another unit setup based on my initial one.

Orator
Brave 97 Faith 03
Speechcraft
ArtsofWar
First Strike or Shirahadori
Safeguard
Teleport

Fomalhaut
n\a
ribbon
Brave Suit
Brigand's Gloves

So the team will be 2x Dark Knights, 2x Ninjas, and a Orator. Because I can now decrease speed from afar, it allows me to keep my team even more spreed out and combines the 2 skills ArtsofWar and Speechcraft to one unit. An opponent can counter the gun with Shirahadori, that is until it's Bravery is lowered. The down side though is that you only get one attempt at lowering the speed.
#7AlmasNo1FanPosted 11/23/2012 10:12:02 PM
alma beoulve
cleric / 31 brave 89 faith
holy magicks / iaido / reflex / magic attack up / teleport
dreamwaker / ribbon / lordly robe / featherweave cloak

.. bam!
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#8aerisfanboyPosted 11/24/2012 9:11:10 AM
Adashee posted...
aerisfanboy posted...
With or without Math Skill? o.O


In melee players has the option to disable Match skill/Arithmeticks or not. Regardless, due to the teams low faith, all magic attack are largely ineffective........ with the exception of Quickening.

Yes, quickening can beat this team....... but it depends. If this is a battle with standard leveled units, then the Quickening team will win, assuming its equiped to outspeed the ninja's. However if it's a Maxed-Out stat battle, then the outcome may be decided who is "first" player and what map is used. First player wins on Speed ties and since the Ninja are configured to move 7 spaces, depending on the map, they can move in and throw to kill a mage. Since Quickening is depending on premeditated pattern, killing Mage 1 or 2 will disrupt their attempt to get the Quickening started. Also a quickening shouldn't have any auto-revive equipment since all such equipment is paired with regen as well (it messes with Critical Quick setup.)

As long as the ninja can Throw (and not miss) and kill a single mage before the Quicken team takes a turn, you can win. I have never tested this though, and this is all based on theory-concept. But because both players need to consent to the rules before the match, all this can be avoided, lol.


I've been thinking up another unit setup based on my initial one.

Orator
Brave 97 Faith 03
Speechcraft
ArtsofWar
First Strike or Shirahadori
Safeguard
Teleport

Fomalhaut
n\a
ribbon
Brave Suit
Brigand's Gloves

So the team will be 2x Dark Knights, 2x Ninjas, and a Orator. Because I can now decrease speed from afar, it allows me to keep my team even more spreed out and combines the 2 skills ArtsofWar and Speechcraft to one unit. An opponent can counter the gun with Shirahadori, that is until it's Bravery is lowered. The down side though is that you only get one attempt at lowering the speed.


You sir, earned my respect. I humbly direct you to the PS1 FFT board. You;ll get a lot more meaningful discussion there.

And yes, I'm VERY interested in the discussion that will follow.
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#9Adashee(Topic Creator)Posted 11/24/2012 9:32:52 AM
aerisfanboy posted...

You sir, earned my respect. I humbly direct you to the PS1 FFT board. You;ll get a lot more meaningful discussion there.

And yes, I'm VERY interested in the discussion that will follow.


Thank for the compliment. I'm not sure if it would be a reverent topic there though, since the original lacks a built-in versus mode and I would have to reinvent the setup a bit to accommodate the lack of WOTL exclusive equipment and Dark Knights. I do agree that it's follower tend to be more knowledgeable and passionate of FFT.

..Unless you mean by 'interested' on the possible flame war that it may start XD.
#10EfratePosted 11/24/2012 1:54:06 PM
Alma, Swordskills from the DKs bypass reflexes + feather mantle since they are unavoidable. 7 move means you won't be able to stay away, and if there is more than a 2H differential you won't be able to hit them. You have to waste at least a turn to mbarrier and hope to stay away long enough for kiku to hit.

Regardless, reraise and regen and haste means given time they will be able to double turn you, save Ct to move into range and chaos blade swordskill you for a 1 hit kill. I dunno K values of DK skills off the top of my head but I am guessing even with protect damage will be around 600 which is more than what you can handle. Thats normal not stat maxed iirc.

Also 7 move and a thrown knightsword with your only 80% p-evade will take you out from effective range 14, 7 move + 7 throw. Its only a 1/5 chance of connecting but with 3 ninjas that's 2 of their turns on average.

So as usual, Alma is proved to be worthless and dead weight. Every time, every place.
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