Best thief heals?

#11azuresou1Posted 12/4/2012 9:19:43 AM
When you want your HP to go up as fast as possible, Hide in Shadows IS the quickest way to go up as fast as possible. This is because it's a spike heal. This is different from Healing per Second, which only matters if you get hit regularly.

Say on my 17K HP, I get hit for 6K damage by a strong mob attack. Hide in Shadows will full heal me in about 1 second. Signet of Malice will take several rounds of attacks to heal me to full; even assuming Unload you're looking at probably 10 seconds of no further attacks to top off. Withdraw will heal you partway, while you need to wait for your CD to heal to full again.

Withdrawing off ledges has nothing to do with being "bad." You tell me how the hell you're going to use Withdraw while fighting Harpies in that Fractal.
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Face it, Blake Griffin is more a SF than (Rashard) Lewis is - Bullet_Proof_18
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#12DyGenGuarPosted 12/4/2012 9:55:20 AM(edited)
You also have to take into account that Hide in Shadows also has a lot more utility than just giving you stealth if you use traits that improve stealth. You can trait to gain initiative, gain might, blind foes around you, remove an additional condition, gain 100% crit, and regenerate more health on top of the Regen boon you already gain. Granted you can't do all of this at once, but you can at least have 3 of these traits.
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#13ZephyLynxPosted 12/4/2012 11:19:37 AM
It all depends on your play style and situation. For me, it depends on if I'm on a cliff/platform or open field.

When there is no worry about falling off, I almost always use Withdraw. It has a fast cool down, and a build in dodge. Using the Vigorous Recovery trait, I can keep up vigor at least 11 out of 15 seconds on hard fights that need more dodging. Coupled with Superior Runes of the Adventure and the Feline Grace trait, I can dodge almost every big attack.

If there is a need to worry about falling off, either of the other 2 heals are good, depending on your build. If you use AoE attacks more, then Signet of Malice works to your advantage, but Hide in Shadows offers spike healing, condition removal, and a cloaking skill all in one and is less build dependent.

Either way, each of the 3 healing skills are good, just depends on how you play and what the situation is. I'd say none of them are clearly superior to the others.
#14JenniferTatePosted 12/5/2012 12:11:21 AM
Hide in Shadows and Malice are awesome. Withdrawal is good with some builds/playstyles.

Without getting into it, I think Hide in Shadows has more utility and is a solid heal. The CD is short enough that the on demand stealth is great in itself, as with a sword or bow I can lock down/kite quite well and by the time I may need a real heal, it's back up. If I don't, it's still great utility.

Malice is good mitigation, and a short CD if you do need a panic button. I don't actively look to Malice to keep me topped up, even with the proper traits and stats. It's just mitigation if I fudge up.

HiS is a nice chunk of healing, but I use it in tandem with Blind more often then I use it for heals, because if you can keep your awareness and reflexes up, the Stealth will save you from even getting hit.
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#15kpkerPosted 12/5/2012 4:37:12 AM(edited)
From: azuresou1 | #011
When you want your HP to go up as fast as possible, Hide in Shadows IS the quickest way to go up as fast as possible. This is because it's a spike heal. This is different from Healing per Second, which only matters if you get hit regularly.

Say on my 17K HP, I get hit for 6K damage by a strong mob attack. Hide in Shadows will full heal me in about 1 second. Signet of Malice will take several rounds of attacks to heal me to full; even assuming Unload you're looking at probably 10 seconds of no further attacks to top off. Withdraw will heal you partway, while you need to wait for your CD to heal to full again.

Withdrawing off ledges has nothing to do with being "bad." You tell me how the hell you're going to use Withdraw while fighting Harpies in that Fractal.


Yeah and what happens when you get hit for 10k and you're left at 7k hp? HiS will heal you up to 13k and if you take anymore than 13k damage in the next 30 seconds you're dead. Withdraw will heal you up to 11.5k and if you survive the next 15 seconds (which you should because it's pve, otherwise you'd be dead either way) the next Withdraw brings you up to 16k hp which is close full health.

Burst heals mean almost nothing in pve. The big damaging attacks either don't happen often or they are telegraphed and easily dodgeable. Sustained healing will always be more powerful because the most common damage monsters do are frequent smaller attacks.

As for Withdrawing off ledges, there are no exceptions if it happens you are bad and need to pay more attention. Why would you even have Withdraw equipped while you're fighting Harpies? Really, it takes one click to change your healing skill. Do you see people complaining about Death Blossoming off ledges over and over? Most people would learn after their first death. The simple solution is to just not use it and switch to a different heal for the encounter. You realize SoM has an on use heal that heals very close to the number that Withdraw heals for right?
#16azuresou1Posted 12/5/2012 11:52:04 AM
Frequent smaller attacks don't mean jack s***, you don't worry about a Harpy hitting you for 1K with the regular attack because they come at a regular cadence and don't hurt. I can eat 5 or 6 Harpy shots before I need to pop Hide in Shadows, in which time that Harpy is in all likelihood already dead. In most parties you're also getting residual healing from shouts, Guardians, wells, springs, regeneration, multiple sources that keep you topped off. What DO you worry about? The Harpy salvo attack that hits you 5 times, and which easily cuts through your residual healing. Hide in Shadows instantly brings you back up to full; Withdraw doesn't.

I haven't even touched upon damaging conditions, which neither Withdraw nor SoM affect. That burning, poison, and multiple stacks of bleeding cut into your HPS, which, BTW, is only marginally better than HIS.

HIS: 192 HPS
SoM: 215 Active
Withdraw: 264 HPS

A single tick of Poison from enemies? About 300 damage. Which also cuts your healing effectiveness by 33%.

If you don't have Withdraw equipped vs. Harpies, then you wouldn't be Withdraw wouldn't be very useful in that situation now, would it? Hm, heal that's applicable in all situations vs. extremely situational heal... tough choice. </sarcasm>

You're jumping through a lot of mental hoops.
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Face it, Blake Griffin is more a SF than (Rashard) Lewis is - Bullet_Proof_18
Formerly Known As SSJ5Vegeta
#17LOLownageasdPosted 12/5/2012 11:03:48 PM
trash mobs mean nothing idk why you're even talking about harpys when they don't matter

see
Yeah and what happens when you get hit for 10k and you're left at 7k hp? HiS will heal you up to 13k and if you take anymore than 13k damage in the next 30 seconds you're dead. Withdraw will heal you up to 11.5k and if you survive the next 15 seconds (which you should because it's pve, otherwise you'd be dead either way) the next Withdraw brings you up to 16k hp which is close full health.

for a situation that actually matters, a boss fight. HiS will NOT heal you to full health in that situation and that is where hp/s comes into play.

lol being unable to use a skill on a small platform makes it extremely situational? 90% of dungeons in the game happen on extremely wide areas bro and like i said condition removal is ok but its available through utility. you only have 1 heal slot and 3 utility slots so your heal should be dedicated to having the best heal aka hp/s since big heals are not available anywhere else and all that other stuff like condition removal can be obtained from utility
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#18LOLownageasdPosted 12/5/2012 11:18:10 PM
oh and that is not marginally better, the difference is quite significant. 1 minute into a fight and Withdraw heals 4320 more than HiS which is like 1 whole use of a heal. the difference only gets bigger as the fight goes on
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