Advanced stuff - skill morphing in P4

#1ArthellinusPosted 12/2/2008 1:16:42 AM
Now that I have my hands on the DJ guide, I can start cranking out updates for the DB; it'll be one cohesive whole like what I did with the original P3 (not FES). This is all more or less a less organized preview based on (almost) complete skill info and some hard work by Zeruel and 98sr075 from older topics.

Now, skill morphing in P4 is much more restricted but just as powerful as it was in P3 and maybe even a little easier. Let me get into the details right away. No prior knowledge of skill morphing concepts is necessary.

Now, morphing in P4 comes in two forms. I'll go through both of them.

1. This requires a normal Magician card in Arcana Chance. We may refer to this as either vertical morphing or skill rank-up. This is the process by which a skill changes to another skill of a higher rank. This sounds like P3's morphing but is very restricted. Only a certain set of skills can undergo this type of morphing and the skills to which they rank up are FIXED. Furthermore, unless this skill is a physical skill, once it has ranked up it will NEVER rank up again.

The list of these (non-physical) skills so far, as compiled by Zeruel:
Agi -> Maragi
Agilao -> Maragion
Agidyne -> Maragidyne
Bufu -> Mabufu
Bufula -> Mabufula
Bufudyne -> Mabufudyne
Zio -> Mazio
Zionga -> Mazionga
Ziodyne -> Maziodyne
Garu -> Magaru
Garula -> Magarula
Garudyne -> Magarudyne
Hama -> Mahama
Hamaon -> Mahamaon
Mudo -> Mamudo
Mudoon -> Mamudoon
Megido -> Megidola -> Megidolaon
Dia -> Media
Diarama -> Mediarama
Diarahan -> Mediarahan
Patra -> Me Patra
Tarukaja -> Matarukaja
Rakukaja -> Marakukaja
Sukukaja -> Masukukaja
Tarunda -> Matarunda
Rakunda -> Marakunda
Sukunda -> Masukunda

Physical skills are a little different. They CAN rank up more than once, but again it's a set process. Physical skills that can do this fall into one of three "chains." -- one is for Slash skills, one for Strike skills, and one for Pierce skills, even though there is no official distinction between these skills. Again, credit to Zeruel:

Slash chain: Cleave -> Fatal End -> Blade of Fury -> Deathbound -> Tempest Slash
Strike chain: Bash -> Assault Dive -> Kill Rush -> Gigantic Fist -> Heat Wave -> God's Hand
Pierce chain: (incomplete) Arrow Rain -> Myriad Arrows

Note that if the Magician card in AC is reversed, the exact opposite will happen, e.g. if the Persona has Media, it will change to Dia. I don't need to tell you that this is bad.

This is the first type of morphing, and it's not the one to exploit, but its availability is certainly higher, as you can do this as many times as you want.
#2Arthellinus(Topic Creator)Posted 12/2/2008 1:39:43 AM
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#3Arthellinus(Topic Creator)Posted 12/2/2008 2:00:52 AM
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#4Arthellinus(Topic Creator)Posted 12/2/2008 2:01:52 AM
2. The potential of this method was first brought to my attention by 98sr075. I'll get to what he talked about later, but the method here is fusion forecast skill change, which we can alternatively refer to as horizontal morphing. It is much more powerful, but you only have a certain number of chances to use it given the nature of fusion forecast (which I'm going to assume you understand).

On certain days, fusion forecast will provide you with the opportunity to have one of the skills on your fused Persona randomly change into another skill of the same rank. This is a pretty surefire way to beat the inheritance system. For example, you could fuse a Fire-type Persona with a skill of Rank 6 (the rank for Ma-dyne skills) have it change into Mabufudyne.

Aside from obvious exploitation of elemental skills, here are a few of the things you can do:
- Teach God's Hand, Primal Force, or Vorpal Blade to a Persona that can't normally learn it by fusing a Persona with another Rank 8 skill (Megidolaon, Salvation, Absorb Phys/Fire/Ice/Elec/Wind, Divine Grace).
- Similarly, teach Salvation to a Persona that can't normally learn it.
- Learn God's Judgment and Hell's Judgment, which, according to the DJ guide, are Light/Dark attacks that halve the enemy's HP AND have the same effect as Samsara/Die for Me! In fact, this is the ONLY way to acquire these two skills.
- Learn Victory Cry at Lv 24.

Now, let me explain that last bit. 98sr075 informed us in an older thread that he found on the JP wiki that you can pretty much break the game by the time you get to Lv 24. If you don't want to know about this, then stop reading right here.

Lv 24 Kaiwan (first Star Persona) has Tetrakarn as a default skill. Tetrakarn is a Rank 7 skill. This means that if you get a skill change on Tetrakarn when fusing Kaiwan, it may become any of the following: Brave Blade, Rainy Death, Akasha Arts, Myriad Arrows, Agneyastra, Blight, Mediarahan, Tetra Break, Makara Break, Makarakarn, Repel Phys/Fire/Ice/Elec/Wind/Light/Dark, Angelic Grace, Enduring Soul, Arms/Spell Master, and yes, Victory Cry. See any skills in there that you like?

This has the potential for massive, massive abuse early in the game if you want it. Simply start fusing Kaiwan every time you can perform a forecast skill change once you reach Lv 24 and reset until you get the skill you want. Keep doing this to fill out your Rank 7 skills as early as possible.

You don't have to be cheap about it in this way, but you can start looking through other possibilities of how to bypass the inheritance system to really customize your favorite Personas with high-end skills.

Just in case anyone was wondering about Rank 8 skills, we can use Divine Grace in a similar fashion, but it will take longer. The first Persona with access to it is Neko Shogun at Lv 37, which is +5 to base and requires a pentagon spread. Next up would be Parvati at Lv 43. Once you learn Divine Grace, you can spread it through fusion and try your luck with skill change. Walking around with Vorpal Blade in the low 40s doesn't sound like a bad idea...

The schedule for forecast skill changes is:
April - 24
May - 4, 18, 20, 25
June - 24, 27
July - 4, 14, 15, 30
August - 4, 5, 22, 23, 25, 29, 30
September - 4, 5, 16, 18, 25 (must use Throne as an ingredient, also +Ice skill), 27
October - 3, 26, 31
November - 3, 7, 9, 13
December - 13

So take advantage of those opportunities. You don't get all that many of them. In case you were wondering, on your first time through you can realistically expect to be around Lv 24 by June.

Happy fusing (and morphing)!
#5KoujaPosted 12/2/2008 10:30:42 AM
BUMP and TAG.
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Now Playing: Devil May Cry 4 - Professor Layton.
Next Up: Persona 4; Odin Sphere; DDS; P2:IS.
#6Look over therePosted 12/2/2008 10:43:28 AM
Ah, good stuff. You know I'm gonna try to have Victory Cry on everything I will use now.
#7Look over therePosted 12/2/2008 11:03:35 AM
Oh, along these lines; what rank is Null Light/Dark and how early can we get a skill in that rank?
#8opfer_gvPosted 12/2/2008 11:14:44 AM
Null skills are Rank 6 skills. Without Fusion Forecast/Arcana Chance, you have to wait for level 60~70. (Except Null Fire and Wind which can be obtain at level 27~8)
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Retry? Abort? Cancel?
#9Arthellinus(Topic Creator)Posted 12/2/2008 11:17:07 AM
General ranks:

1 - Agi/Bufu/Zio/Garu
2 - Maragi etc.
3 - Agilao etc.
4 - Maragion etc.
5 - Agidyne etc.
6 - Maragidyne etc.

2 - Hama/Mudo
3 - Mahama/Mamudo
5 - Hamaon/Mudoon
6 - Mahamaon/Mamudoon

1 - Dia
2 - Recarm
3 - Diarama/Media
5 - Diarahan/Mediarama/Samarecarm
7 - Mediarahan
8 - Salvation

1 - Single-hit ailments
3 - All-hit ailments
2 - Resist ailments
4 - Null ailments

1 - Dodge Phys/Fire/Ice/Elec/Wind
4 - Evade elements
4 - Resist elements
6 - Null elements
7 - Repel elements
8 - Absorb elements

4 - Survive Light/Dark
5 - Endure Light/Dark
6 - Null Light/Dark
7 - Repel Light/Dark

3 - Auto-Taru/Raku/Suku
6 - Auto-Mataru/Maraku/Masuku


Skill tally by rank:

Rank 1 - 27 skills
Rank 2 - 37 skills
Rank 3 - 40 skills*
Rank 4 - 52 skills (...)
Rank 5 - 30 skills
Rank 6 - 30 skills
Rank 7 - 23 skills
Rank 8 - 13 skills
Unique - 14 skills

*I don't have a skill rank listing for Traesto, so I put it in Rank 3 with Trafuri


The earliest Rank 6 skill you can get is Ghastly Wail from Yomotsu-Shikome at Lv 11, which you would need to fuse onto someone else.
#10Arthellinus(Topic Creator)Posted 12/2/2008 11:20:09 AM
I have a question, opfer. Does the forecast change happen after your fused Persona levels up fully from bonus experience (and gets those extra skills) or before?