Good Dual-Wielding, Duelist/Assassin build?

#1ZozmaSagePosted 11/22/2009 3:31:37 PM
Good Dual-Wielding, Duelist/Assassin build?

message detail Anyone have a good idea for a dual-wielding duelist/assassin build? I want to able to do reasonable damage and be skilled enough in coercion to get my way most of the time. Anyone have any ideal stat placements and ability choices for a build like that?
#2hauntbotPosted 11/22/2009 3:36:45 PM

towards the end of the topic i really break things down in detail.... who knows, i might wind up doing a character build faq at this rate, lol.

duelist/assassin is better off as a str rogue. if you have high cunning you might as well go bard instead for the synergies betwen the assassin crit rate, the cunning based song of courage, and lethality/dual wield expertise/etc.
~The Black Boardsman & Hundred Topic Slayer~ Viva El Noobie!
#3Noblesse_ObligePosted 11/22/2009 3:44:26 PM
^You should do it. You owned the Fallout 3 board. Might as well take this one too.
#4ZozmaSage(Topic Creator)Posted 11/22/2009 3:48:28 PM
str rogues have it a little bit easier, potentially:

race: definitely dwarf

dirty fighting tree: 3

below the belt:4

deft hands: 4

duelist: 4

dual wield 1st tree: 2

dual wield last tree:3

and then either assasin 1 and stealth 4 or ranger 4, your option (partly based on whether you use leliana or not, and how many group buffs you use. a pet loaded up with haste and song of courage is fantastic. on its own.... the mark is probably better)

for a grand total of 24-25 points. no one ever said being a rogue was easy(well....i didnt, anyways, lol). the plus side is that a well built warrior shouldnt really need those skillbooks anyways, so theres no reason not to give them all to your main if youre a rogue.

combat tactics are relatively similar, but you stealth isnt as vital, since you arent so frail.


veshaille & rose for weapons, warden commander armor, red jenny seekers, helm of honnleath, all the same accessories as the cunning rogue yadda yadda yadda. you have mroe freedom in boot choice, but there really arent any great options.... you can stick with bards shoes, or you can go with the warden commander boots for +50 stamina. juggernaut boots might not be bad if used with ring of the ages for more elemental durability. too bad the warden set is busted, or it may be tempting to use the full set instead of the red jenny seekers.

16-22 cunning (5 cunning can be got through plot, do mages circle quest asap) depending on whether you want stealth or not

thoughts on skills for both types of rogues:

you definitely want max coercion, especially for cunning rogue. even though combat training 4 isnt necessary, imo its a good choice- extra armor and extra attack rating.

more than 1 point in poisons isnt necessary- make zevran your poison maker, leave him in camp and occasionally take him into town to restock your poisons between quests. rogues start with 1 in poison for free, so basically never touch poison.

max trapmaking can be important even if you dont use traps much-it helps you notice them and disarm them, saving you a lot of hassle(they can be disarmed while in stealth too after you get your stealth skill up! ;D) then again, if you use stealth often you dont need to notice traps from massive distances, so if you dont like traps but still use stealth a lot (even though traps are perfect for stealth :p) you might only want to go 2 levels.

*if* you can manage all this and still have points to spare you may want to look into maxing survival for the physical and nature resistance boosts. a str rogue might even want to leave combat training at 3 to make maxing this a bit easier.

kudos to anyone who manages to read all this, hope its helpful! :)

actually for cunning rogue id just go assassin 2. got lacerate & exploits order mixed up. lacerate is pretty.... meh. so cunning rogue actually has it as easy or easier than str rogues as far as total build reqs go.

i havent done any hard evaluation on which one of these builds is better in a full game real play, as i said my current, flawed builds have both had issues- my str rogue with lockpicking due to neglecting it for too long, and my cunning due to neglecting strength early game.....and just sucking mid game (though i went duelist with him, another boo boo). i will say that my str dwarf rogue kicks absolute ass in combat; no problems there. my cunning rogue was also an elf, which doesnt help much. i heard city elves get a good dagger very late game that you may or may not want to sub for the dead thaig..... but +2 will and + 2 mag just dont do much for your character, unless you have ranger for the pet too.

like glenn said, get used to playing your main almost exlcusively, and set up the rest of your party with good ai routines- tactics 3 is a great investment for your other 3, imo

So this, then?
#5hauntbotPosted 11/22/2009 4:12:34 PM
^You should do it. You owned the Fallout 3 board. Might as well take this one too.

lmao... well, there were a lot of cool people on the fo3 boards, some of which have migrated over here. *but* i really like mes character building a lot more than fo3s..... theres a lot more room for debate & discussion about different builds amongst particular classes. fo3 was just sorta like "heres the ultimate character! feel free to do something else if you like, but it wont be as good in the end" i hate it when games do that. :l granted, you can do that with glitching here, but at least you have to glitch to do it.

So this, then?

yeap. assassin is only good for the first rank. backstabs + good backstab gear+pinpoint strike + momentum + mark= lulz.

on one hand it seems sorta a shame to take a spec and not go that deep in it, but as you can tell, the builds are really stretched in any case.
~The Black Boardsman & Hundred Topic Slayer~ Viva El Noobie!
#6neomage23xPosted 11/22/2009 4:16:04 PM
in that case....would you recommend taking Duelist first at level 7, then Assassin at level14?

My rogue just reached level 7 and has the option of taking Duelist now........

since I have yet to unlock Assassin, should I take Duelist now and wait till level 14 before taking Assassin?
#7ZozmaSage(Topic Creator)Posted 11/22/2009 4:16:28 PM
Would it be a bad idea to ignore assassin completely, then, in favor of a pure duelist?
#8hauntbotPosted 11/22/2009 4:22:26 PM
Would it be a bad idea to ignore assassin completely, then, in favor of a pure duelist?

like i say if you skip assassin then get ranger for the pets..... this means passing up stealth too.....but the pets are awesome, especially if you use lots of group-wide buffs. so its your call. stealth + assassin mark or ranger master. :l

if you take assassin first just focus on getting other abilities, and hoard all the physical talent books you find so as soon as 14 hits you can learn duelist all the way up to keen defense.

imo the mark is a little more useful than the early duelist abilities..... but then again duelists passives are great too. cant really go wrong either way.
~The Black Boardsman & Hundred Topic Slayer~ Viva El Noobie!
#9neomage23xPosted 11/22/2009 4:31:16 PM
thanks hauntbot!

course....that's assuming you have both Assassin and Duelist unlocked and available by level 7.....right?

since I only have Duelist unlocked......I'm thinking I should just take that now at level 7, since it's going to be some time before I'm able to unlock Assassin ( hopefully by level 14 ).

or......should I just hold off on both specs, until I unlock Assassin, and focus on my core Rogue and DW talents?

IOW....would it be better to take either spec as soon as possible ( level 7 )? Or, hold off on the specs and build my cored Rogue and DW talents first?
#10hauntbotPosted 11/22/2009 4:40:36 PM
duelist is great too, it wont hurt to take it first if you dont have assassin yet. you get assassin as soon as you finish one main quest branch, so if youre close you might want to wait, but either way it wont really hurt.

just dont fall behind on lockpicking, other than that imo dual wield expertise should be a priority, and the dirty fighting line should be fairly low priority unless you use mind blast a lot already with morrigan.

some people might say momentum should be a priority.... but if you get too much offense too fast, youll draw too much attention in fights, so while i wouldnt say you should deliberately put it off, i wouldnt say you need to make a beeline for it *ASAP* or anything either. make sure you at least can wear good armor before you do! ;D the dwarven noble gets some pretty good armor right off the bat, other than that you might be better off getting to where you can wear blood dragon plate or getting the warden commander armor first.
~The Black Boardsman & Hundred Topic Slayer~ Viva El Noobie!