i have been playing with them lately but can not figure out a good role for them, any one has tips?
Kat can be either a carry or support DPS. Some go AP with her, but after the nerf, a lot of people disagree with going AP, although it can work in some situations. I personally play her as a DPS.
Save a tree. Eat a beaver.
AP Kat is the only way to go at the moment for her ulti. However playing her is the same as playing Shaco or Heimerdinger. As for Nidalee, most people say you go AD, but Hotshotgg (one of the best Nidalee players in the game) says and goes AP. I think it's for more support on heals and greater damage on cougar abilities.
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I still don't see why EVERYONE loves AP Kat so much.
I main Kat, and play her in 90% of my matches.
+Shunpo Damage (0.75 Ratio)
+DL Damage (0.3 AP Ratio)
Lich Bane Proc for Burst Damage
Typically more HP
Rylai's Slow is only 15%, I barely even notice it
DL doesn't scale as well unless you are fed
+BB Damage (1:1 AD Ratio)
+DL Damage (0.5 of ALL AD)
Bloodthirsters = Massive Lifesteal therefore longer laning
Much better Autoswings therefore Sustained DPS
Frozen Mallet / Phage sucks for slowing, you need help
I keep hearing everyone says "GO AP FOR HER ULT"
Let's simplify this, ignore all else since all other stats should be equal.
With no items. Level 6 Kat, Let's just say Rank 3 DL (It doesn't really matter what we use, I'm using a level 6 Kat because it minimizes the damage that AD does, this is to make a point.)
0 AP = 2400 total damage
0 AD = 3360 total damage
It isn't until you get 640 AP, that it scales better than AD.
OK, Made a graph of how it scales. Now I'm estimating that you gain 2x more AP than AD. The X axis is AP
So basically. If you can get Full Mejai's, Zhonya's Ring, Rylai's, Full Rod of Ages, and a LichBane, go AP. (11,425g)
But... 2 Full Bloodthirsters and Full Sword of the Occult matches the same amount of Death Lotus Damage(7,769g)
^ Watch any of my Kat videos. Also, I probably won't be checking this, if you want to flame me, do it on my youtube.
the extra damage from shunpo easily makes up for the lower DL scaling and you will likely have mpen with AP build. autoattack damage is meaningless since she's not a autoattack champ anyway.
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**** charlie brown christmas
I am almost convinced that people like AP only because of Rylai. Get lizard if you absolutely cannot work without a slow.
Shunpo is a double edged sword, especially against cc heavy teams. Shunpoing onto a champion means that you are dealing some decent damage (assuming AP), but at the same time you are at their mercy and depending who you just landed on, and on how many people are around, could mean a quick death for you. BB on the other hand is an excellent harassment tool during the pre-team-engagement phase and poses no danger to you whatsoever, and if your AD is high enough, it not only can deal about as much damage as shunpo, but to 5 champions (and a heal reduction on top of that).
As to the 2nd part of TC's question: I've seen more AP nid than AD nid nowadays, probably because of HotshotGG's build. Don't remember the whole build but I know he starts off with doran's ring, boots, sheen->lichbane then goes from there.