Face the facts...

#141games1256Posted 1/5/2013 10:55:22 AM
_Signal posted...
games1256 posted...
old_man_mossy posted...
Well if you can twist fiction into 'reality' enough to think like Games...that HVS signed up to a contract/agreed to a contract that allowed Sega to publish a game in such limited numbers, with such craptacular advertising and retail availibility that HVS would loose money.....then clearly HVS is either devoted or mad....they don't care about profit at all and just keep putting work into something they believe in and trying to keep the product 'active' in the day to day happenings.

Kinda what all inventors/scientist do when they believe on something...but I digress. I'm still working off of the false narrative Games has suggested that HVS lost money....anywho...

They believe in it, and themselves...if games theory is to be believed...and therefore the series continues, be it an Edsil or not. It continues...and if they have to be patient and push for a publisher while producing licensed shovel ware to publish their own IP's...so be it.

Even if he right...which he's not....he's wrong. No one invests into a project guaranteed to lose money by a limited print run...even if the print run sells out....unless they have another move to make, or another motive....like showing it does great community involved support or can make two radically different games in the same series by listening to and acting on fan input.

HVS is not done with Conduit. I'd wager they would go bankrupt before they write off making a C3.

Based on the break even point for a wii game they lost money. But believe what you want and think they made money.


I really don't want to feed this thread, but what precisely in dollars of sales is the break even point for a Wii game?

Considering the physical disks cost about one dollar to make, or even less, that the game sold for $50 at release, and even when I bought it several months later, and considering that Gamestop probably got about $15 of that. That means that $35 from each copy sold went back to Sega minus the $2 to physically produce the disk, case, and instruction booklet. So, Sega got $33 for each game sold and spent zero on advertising so they "made" $33 on each unit sold minus the royalties and development costs paid to HVS. Sega did fine on this game.

Since HVS had a contract to produce the game for Sega, they were probably paid up front for the development cost of the game, along with receiving royalties per unit sold, usually in the 5% range.

I think everyone would really like to see the actual numbers that you're basing your claims on.

HVS paid to make the game they lost money. Sega made money.
#142games1256Posted 1/5/2013 11:00:34 AM
games1256 posted...
_Signal posted...
games1256 posted...
old_man_mossy posted...
Well if you can twist fiction into 'reality' enough to think like Games...that HVS signed up to a contract/agreed to a contract that allowed Sega to publish a game in such limited numbers, with such craptacular advertising and retail availibility that HVS would loose money.....then clearly HVS is either devoted or mad....they don't care about profit at all and just keep putting work into something they believe in and trying to keep the product 'active' in the day to day happenings.

Kinda what all inventors/scientist do when they believe on something...but I digress. I'm still working off of the false narrative Games has suggested that HVS lost money....anywho...

They believe in it, and themselves...if games theory is to be believed...and therefore the series continues, be it an Edsil or not. It continues...and if they have to be patient and push for a publisher while producing licensed shovel ware to publish their own IP's...so be it.

Even if he right...which he's not....he's wrong. No one invests into a project guaranteed to lose money by a limited print run...even if the print run sells out....unless they have another move to make, or another motive....like showing it does great community involved support or can make two radically different games in the same series by listening to and acting on fan input.

HVS is not done with Conduit. I'd wager they would go bankrupt before they write off making a C3.

Based on the break even point for a wii game they lost money. But believe what you want and think they made money.


I really don't want to feed this thread, but what precisely in dollars of sales is the break even point for a Wii game?

Considering the physical disks cost about one dollar to make, or even less, that the game sold for $50 at release, and even when I bought it several months later, and considering that Gamestop probably got about $15 of that. That means that $35 from each copy sold went back to Sega minus the $2 to physically produce the disk, case, and instruction booklet. So, Sega got $33 for each game sold and spent zero on advertising so they "made" $33 on each unit sold minus the royalties and development costs paid to HVS. Sega did fine on this game.

Since HVS had a contract to produce the game for Sega, they were probably paid up front for the development cost of the game, along with receiving royalties per unit sold, usually in the 5% range.

I think everyone would really like to see the actual numbers that you're basing your claims on.

HVS paid to make the game they lost money. Sega made money.

The break even is 250k units.
#143old_man_mossyPosted 1/5/2013 11:02:21 AM
[This message was deleted at the request of the original poster]
#144TheOmegaShenPosted 1/5/2013 11:08:17 AM
LigersRule posted...
TheOmegaShen posted...
LigersRule posted...
old_man_mossy posted...
I actually rather dislike them...they couldn't do consoles right and do only a passable job with their other products.


TAKE THAT BACK! NOW!

The Dreamcast is the single best console of all time, and anyone who says otherwise is a terrible person for trying to deceive the population of the world. If anybody ever insults SEGA's console making abilities in front of my face, they won't leave with as much blood as they had before.


The Dreamcast is overrated.


You're dead to me, Shen. Even as I type, I'm loading up Jet Set Radio, because I need a short break from Sonic Adventure 2. The Dreamcast is perfect.


Is that worth buying along with NiGHTS into Dreams for $20?

Oh, and the Genesis was better. ;) Ristar, Vectorman 1 and 2, Alex Kidd, Golden Axe, Sonic 1-3K, Shinobi 3, etc.
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#145old_man_mossyPosted 1/5/2013 11:21:27 AM(edited)
_Signal posted...
games1256 posted...
old_man_mossy posted...
Well if you can twist fiction into 'reality' enough to think like Games...that HVS signed up to a contract/agreed to a contract that allowed Sega to publish a game in such limited numbers, with such craptacular advertising and retail availibility that HVS would loose money.....then clearly HVS is either devoted or mad....they don't care about profit at all and just keep putting work into something they believe in and trying to keep the product 'active' in the day to day happenings.

Kinda what all inventors/scientist do when they believe on something...but I digress. I'm still working off of the false narrative Games has suggested that HVS lost money....anywho...

They believe in it, and themselves...if games theory is to be believed...and therefore the series continues, be it an Edsil or not. It continues...and if they have to be patient and push for a publisher while producing licensed shovel ware to publish their own IP's...so be it.

Even if he right...which he's not....he's wrong. No one invests into a project guaranteed to lose money by a limited print run...even if the print run sells out....unless they have another move to make, or another motive....like showing it does great community involved support or can make two radically different games in the same series by listening to and acting on fan input.

HVS is not done with Conduit. I'd wager they would go bankrupt before they write off making a C3.

Based on the break even point for a wii game they lost money. But believe what you want and think they made money.


I really don't want to feed this thread, but what precisely in dollars of sales is the break even point for a Wii game?

Considering the physical disks cost about one dollar to make, or even less, that the game sold for $50 at release, and even when I bought it several months later, and considering that Gamestop probably got about $15 of that. That means that $35 from each copy sold went back to Sega minus the $2 to physically produce the disk, case, and instruction booklet. So, Sega got $33 for each game sold and spent zero on advertising so they "made" $33 on each unit sold minus the royalties and development costs paid to HVS. Sega did fine on this game.

Since HVS had a contract to produce the game for Sega, they were probably paid up front for the development cost of the game, along with receiving royalties per unit sold, usually in the 5% range.

I think everyone would really like to see the actual numbers that you're basing your claims on.


The fact that HVS was likely paid up front for the right to publish/vend their intellectual property likely never occurred to this "de lost da monies" goober. Never mind royalties per unit sold.

Once it's published as long as the Dev is seeking profit during contract negotiations... nothing short of a lawsuit or an intentional money loosing scheme (for laundering and or tax evasion purposes, or taling a hit for reputation building purposes) will ever cost a developer squat. they already are paid...but can stand to make more depending on contract details like amounts paid out per unit sold.

He doesn't get it Signal, nor does he want to. I suggest blocking him, it will help you avoid frustration and clean up your page.
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"Insurrection is the most sacred of the rights and the most idispensible of duties" - Marquis de La Fayette
#146games1256Posted 1/5/2013 11:28:11 AM
It is well known that HVS paid the cost of the game. But be in denial that your precious HVS made money and that there will be a conduit 3.

I am done. Just be in denial and pretend HVS was the victim with Sega even though Sega was the only publisher who would work with HVS for conduit 2. Hence why the grinder has not found a publisher and Conduit 3DS has never found a publisher. The only victim in the HVS game releases is people who bought into the fact that HVS cared about the hardcore of the wii. They did not. HVS saw the big games on the 360 and ps3 and knew they could not compete so that is how the conduit came to the wii.
#147games1256Posted 1/5/2013 11:29:57 AM
You all do not get it. You say I should not run a company. Well you should not if you think HVS will make a conduit 3. They have to make money and a conduit 3 would not do that.
#148_SignalPosted 1/5/2013 1:47:13 PM
games1256 posted...
You all do not get it. You say I should not run a company. Well you should not if you think HVS will make a conduit 3. They have to make money and a conduit 3 would not do that.


I knew you weren't done.
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#149CynralKynathelPosted 1/5/2013 2:42:52 PM
games1256 posted...
You all do not get it. You say I should not run a company. Well you should not if you think HVS will make a conduit 3. They have to make money and a conduit 3 would not do that.


If HVS set it off as a side project and really worked on it while gaining money from other games. Eventually it could turn out to be a great game, and with some proper ads and some testing it could still turn the series around. Just because the earlier games were "bad" doesn't mean that the 3rd I stallment won't sell. If it was given amazing reviews, then people might like it.
Now I'm not saying there will be a third game but if there was, and they did that, then it probably won't be a so called 'flop' like the 1st and 2nd game were.
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#150HungoverHero777Posted 1/5/2013 2:46:19 PM
games1256 posted...
You all do not get it. You say I should not run a company. Well you should not if you think HVS will make a conduit 3. They have to make money and a conduit 3 would not do that.


>Says he's done.
>Posts again immediately after.
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