What the heck is an arena shooter anyway?

#31DerppopotamusPosted 6/27/2014 5:33:33 PM
CynralKynathel posted...
Also, another problem I find is that he goes on like arena shooters are the best kind of shooters. I can't agree to that because, in my opinion, arena shooters aren't that fun because it provides little variety in teams. Remember all the times that you played the long range weapon set on sanctum? Of course not, because it was all Explosives weapon set on Streets. I would often get into a game pumped and then spend the next hour doing the same map and weapon set over and over and over. At which point I would get bored and leave, or get lucky once and be able to play something different. I'd rather play a game where I can change my play style rather than be forced to have one because everybody voted that we be snipers or a tactical team or close combat tanks.


That's more of TCon thing. The Wii's ram can't hold the models for all the weapons in the game along side the multiplayer bits. So they decided to keep a limited amount of weapons on field at a time. Thats why in C2 sometimes when you pick up a different weapon you'll hear loud disc reading and won't have a weapon for a couple seconds.

In Quake 3 you can use any weapon in the game as long as you can find it on the map. Same thing with Unreal Tournament (Don't know about the later ones, never played em,) Dues Ex, Doom 2.
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#32LigersRulePosted 6/28/2014 8:47:58 AM
CynralKynathel posted...
Also, another problem I find is that he goes on like arena shooters are the best kind of shooters. I can't agree to that because, in my opinion, arena shooters aren't that fun because it provides little variety in teams. Remember all the times that you played the long range weapon set on sanctum? Of course not, because it was all Explosives weapon set on Streets. I would often get into a game pumped and then spend the next hour doing the same map and weapon set over and over and over. At which point I would get bored and leave, or get lucky once and be able to play something different. I'd rather play a game where I can change my play style rather than be forced to have one because everybody voted that we be snipers or a tactical team or close combat tanks.

What I'm saying is arena shooters can get boring, and being max level with all the items doesn't mean s***.


Yeah, Derps is right. That's just a TCon thing. TCon was kind of a pseudo Arena shooter. True arena shooters don't have stupid voting mechanics or weapon sets.

The other thing about Arena shooters is that you have to have quite a bit of skill with every single weapon. You might be fighting with a typical machine gun one second, then find a Railgun and switch to that. Sure you can have a specialty, but even then you need to at least be able to hold your own with everything.

Loadouts, though... I mean, what's the point in me learning to be good with the Strike Rifle when I can spawn with a PR anytime I want? If I don't care for the SCAR, I never have to worry about it. I can use any weapon I want and never touch it.

We can look at it with players, too. I mean, Noble was one of the best PR snipers in the game. Can anybody tell me how good he was with the Strike Rifle? I doubt it, because as far as I can remember, he never used it. He never had to.
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#33CmoIsDaNam3Posted 6/28/2014 11:54:03 AM
But thats what I love about it, don't have to use weapons you don't want to.
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#34CynralKynathelPosted 6/28/2014 1:29:40 PM
LigersRule posted...
CynralKynathel posted...



Oh. That makes a difference. However, is using only one gun and being good with it not skill? It's like taking all the skill points one will earn and focusing on one particular stat. Perhaps the play style of a sniper is what he/she excels at. Being stuck in an arena where a particular rifle spawns anywhere can be un-fun. Oft times the player will be forced to play a style that doesn't suit them to get their weapon of choice which can result in a number of deaths. I'd honestly rather start with my favorite weapon and have fun with it, instead of search a map for it or force myself to use a play style I'm not suited to.

Also going against a player who uses only one weapon means they'll play a predictable play style. In which case you can easily play around it unless the weapon they're using happens to be over-powered. Simply switch up your patching and run in erratic patterns or bob and weave or something. You could even rely on your teammates which probably have some sort of style that counters the first mentioned weapon's style. If you still manage to lose after doing that, then you're most likely out of their league.

In my opinion, I prefer having loadouts over finding the weapons scattered throughout an arena.
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#35CmoIsDaNam3Posted 6/28/2014 1:40:47 PM
^Indeeeeeed.
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#36PancakeLolPosted 6/28/2014 2:33:08 PM
They way I took everything posted here is:

Arena shooters: Well rounded players

Generic shooters, cod etc: One trick ponies

Idk just seems right, but I think that people in general don't like giving up what they have to learn something new. Just like my art teacher told me "You have to know the rules, before you can break them"
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#37F4LCONSW4GPosted 6/28/2014 2:39:43 PM
What you casuals don't seem to get is that you're inherently lowering the skill gap by allowing loadouts. Not only does it hurt balance from the get-go by adding in all this random s***, it completely demolishes the skill gap. Does anyone else remember what Noble used a lot? The PR, HC, and SCAR. Some of the easiest guns to use. When you don't have to learn how to use each gun properly and add in all the other bulls*** like aim assist, reduced ADS sensitivity, killstreaks, and more, even a toddler could go pro.

Not that any of this matters, though. The vocal majority sucks at games, and devs want their money more than keeping competitive play alive. As I said in my first post, the days of Quakes and Dooms are over. Competitive gaming isn't as niche as it once was, and that accesibility and recognition has been its downfall.
#38SupahShnipaPosted 6/28/2014 6:21:21 PM
CynralKynathel posted...
Oft times the player will be forced to play a style that doesn't suit them to get their weapon of choice which can result in a number of deaths.


That's the point. Good players should be good at everything. People will always have certain elements of their playstyle that stick out but you need to learn how to contribute to your team in all situations. During a match the game is always changing. You can't just pick one style and roll with it as you have to constantly adapt to the situation.
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#39LigersRulePosted 6/28/2014 6:36:45 PM
F4LCONSW4G posted...
Does anyone else remember what Noble used a lot? The PR, HC, and SCAR. Some of the easiest guns to use. When you don't have to learn how to use each gun properly and add in all the other bulls*** like aim assist, reduced ADS sensitivity, killstreaks, and more, even a toddler could go pro.


Disclaimer: I can't speak for Falcon, but I think Noble is a pretty cool dude. He's just a nice example for this.

Anyway, Cyn, can you really say that someone who's ONLY good with a Sniper is as skilled as someone who can play any gun? I wouldn't. With their best gun, the 2nd player could go toe-to-toe with player 1. In any situation? Player 2 would win every single time. In unfavorable circumstances, player 1 would lose. But in the same situation for Player 2, he would have a significant chance at survival.

Loadouts pander to players who don't want to go the extra mile. They don't want to be skilled, they want to win. I personally don't get any pleasure from winning, I get pleasure from the gameplay. And the gameplay is funnest when it's varied.

Modern shooters can either be repetitive and competitive, or varied and one-sided. Arena shooters are, by default, varied, and much more often competitive.
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#40_Signal(Topic Creator)Posted 6/28/2014 7:05:04 PM
Do you think kids on playgrounds 70 years ago whined the first time little Jimmy showed up with an oversized shooter marble?

Maybe they did.

"That marble is OP!"

"Your marble takes less skill!"

"Anyone could win with one of those marbles!"

"Jimmy you suck!"

and so on.

But even as they whined, they all secretly wished for an oversized shooter marble of their very own.

Then before anyone even noticed, everyone was playing with oversized shooter marbles.

The tom-bowler was probably what ultimately caused the game of marbles to fall out of favor, because it's a well established fact that most non-casual marble players prefer arena shooter marbles.
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