"Step aside for those who can make the harder choices" spoilers

#1Shaolin015Posted 6/13/2013 7:52:19 AM
I like how Kai leng and TIM kept saying that there were choices to be made that were extremely difficult to make and Shepard wasn't capable of making them. Except, the only difficult decision to make at the end of the game was destroy. Sacrificing the Geth and edi and possibly earth was difficult to do, while control and synthesis were both perfect choices with no sacrifice (assuming you were going to die in all endings, which you should have) .
#2SageOfLifePosted 6/13/2013 7:55:45 AM
Free will seems like a pretty huge sacrifice to me.
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#3edgecrusher02Posted 6/13/2013 8:13:55 AM(edited)
i think that there is sacrifice with all three choices. it is a hard choice in general.

shepard has no idea what will become of him/her in control or whether or not enforcing a way of life using the power of the reapers will last. that form of control over the galaxy didnt work already otherwise shepard would not be standing in that position in the first place. life in the galaxy persisted enough for the possibility of this change to happen.

with synthesis, shepard has absolutely no idea where it will take life in the galaxy. it may be presented in a positive light, but it creates new possibilities and the only way to find out what they are is by trying it. nothing is perfect so to assume it creates a utopia is naive. and a perfect utopia wont work anyway.

and with destroy, the deaths of EDI and the geth is not the only sacrifice. that decision is being made under the idea that all life in the galaxy will have learned from this event and never "irresponsibly" create artificial intelligence again.

they all have potential risks and rewards that go FAR beyond shepard and the current life of this galaxy. the future of all life in the galaxy will be affected by this choice.
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#4Rafficus_IIIPosted 6/13/2013 8:08:19 AM
SageOfLife posted...
Free will seems like a pretty huge sacrifice to me.


Not only that, but look at what you're doing.

Control: you become the abomination that is known as the Catalyst and continue to make puppets out of vast amounts of civilizations before you. Talk about a serious ethics issue right there.

Synthesis: you bring the monstrosities of what the Reapers/Catalyst turned former civilizations into to awareness, while forcing all to practically become Reaperized. And here we have a moral issue.

All this at the behest of an intelligence which had been proven wrong frequently throughout the trilogy.
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#5Shaolin015(Topic Creator)Posted 6/13/2013 8:26:55 AM
Rafficus_III posted...
SageOfLife posted...
Free will seems like a pretty huge sacrifice to me.


Not only that, but look at what you're doing.

Control: you become the abomination that is known as the Catalyst and continue to make puppets out of vast amounts of civilizations before you. Talk about a serious ethics issue right there.

Synthesis: you bring the monstrosities of what the Reapers/Catalyst turned former civilizations into to awareness, while forcing all to practically become Reaperized. And here we have a moral issue.

All this at the behest of an intelligence which had been proven wrong frequently throughout the trilogy.


I'm pretty sure it was implied that control yielded you as the puppet master and you no longer have to continue the cycle. Reapers were used to rebuild society and you don't have to kill society to make a new one. Reapers are immortal anyways.

Synthesis was never painted in the story as being a loss of free will. It was only fan reaction that created that. Synthesis was painted as a utopian ending
#6BingKafeiPosted 6/13/2013 10:30:51 AM
Shaolin015 posted...


I'm pretty sure it was implied that control yielded you as the puppet master and you no longer have to continue the cycle. Reapers were used to rebuild society and you don't have to kill society to make a new one. Reapers are immortal anyways.

Synthesis was never painted in the story as being a loss of free will. It was only fan reaction that created that. Synthesis was painted as a utopian ending


Yeah, but is a Utopian ending really a Utopia for everyone? The main thing I don't like about Control is it means change, evolution and progress would be basically done. No new life forms, no new civilizations - the Synthesized people would create a Utopia and then it's all over. It's perfect. And perfect is way over-rated! The new society of genetically perfect beings with unity and the knowledge of infinite civilizations and basically unlimited resources sounds great for sure; but it'd be the last society ever made, nothing new can come after that. Life would be frozen. I don't think many people other than Shepard could honestly say that things are so perfect they want to due away with change, wanting new life and new creation and new opportunity is part of the reason the Reapers began the cycles in the first place.

But that's beyond the point. Any of the endings is a giant decision that will change the entire galaxy forever and affect absolutely every living thing within it. Isn't that a hard decision?
#7ozzyman314Posted 6/13/2013 10:40:12 AM
Kill the Geth and Destroy becomes quite possibly the easiest decision in the game. Instead of losing an entire race, you only lose EDI, which is a much better sacrifice.
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#8edgecrusher02Posted 6/13/2013 11:33:09 AM(edited)
BingKafei posted...

Yeah, but is a Utopian ending really a Utopia for everyone? The main thing I don't like about Control is it means change, evolution and progress would be basically done. No new life forms, no new civilizations - the Synthesized people would create a Utopia and then it's all over. It's perfect. And perfect is way over-rated! The new society of genetically perfect beings with unity and the knowledge of infinite civilizations and basically unlimited resources sounds great for sure; but it'd be the last society ever made, nothing new can come after that. Life would be frozen. I don't think many people other than Shepard could honestly say that things are so perfect they want to due away with change, wanting new life and new creation and new opportunity is part of the reason the Reapers began the cycles in the first place.

But that's beyond the point. Any of the endings is a giant decision that will change the entire galaxy forever and affect absolutely every living thing within it. Isn't that a hard decision?


i guess it depends on if one thinks it changes that much. isnt it pretty naive to think in absolutes like that? when it comes to any of the endings for that matter, especially when its something new and all we can really do is guess.

the way i see it is that it provides opportunities that were otherwise not possible and it provides things that thus far, have not happened due to what happens when an organic society's technological advancement reaches the point in which it creates artificial intelligence.

i think thats a better way of looking at it than thinking in absolutes and assuming that its a perfect utopia that eventually stagnates life. thats assuming that we know what the end of evolution/life is, and in all reality we have no idea. from what we have seen by studying life thus far, its that it finds a way. we are always finding out new things.

i also think its better than subscribing to the other end of the spectrum and assuming that it takes away free will and forces a way of thinking. i find it INSANELY hard to believe that any of the endings were meant to be presented in a mostly positive way, only for it to actually be the complete opposite and be something extremely negative. i will never understand that mindset.

even though i dont particularly agree with making any ending require more EMS than the others because i think that implies something about which is supposed to be "the best" or at least what the creators think is the best, i can look past that and see it for what it is.
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#9phoenix52Posted 6/13/2013 11:22:41 AM
I never really saw why either Control of Synthesis has to mean that evolution and change would both be halted forever, but I agree that they bring about a lot more to consider than was stated in the first post. Obviously changing the natural order of things in the galaxy is going to have ramifications to consider.
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#10SageOfLifePosted 6/13/2013 11:25:53 AM
Shaolin015 posted...
I'm pretty sure it was implied that control yielded you as the puppet master and you no longer have to continue the cycle. Reapers were used to rebuild society and you don't have to kill society to make a new one. Reapers are immortal anyways.

Synthesis was never painted in the story as being a loss of free will. It was only fan reaction that created that. Synthesis was painted as a utopian ending


A galactic police force of near-omnipotent machines. Yeah, people will really be free in that scenario. *sarcasm hand raised*

Synthesis is a mess beneath all the grammer. Ignoring all the objectively bad storytelling involved, we start with the implication that husks are sentient again. There is no way you can honestly tell me that the thirty or so husks used to make a praetorian are happy with being turned into The Human Centipede. Then we're stuck with everyone being perfectly fine working with the things that until very recently were trying to kill them all. Then we have have EDI claiming that to have gained things she already expressed before the Crucible was fired. Most damning is Wreav acting completely out of character on an issue that has nothing to do with the alleged conflict between organics and synthetics.
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