OH SNAP! Did the 3DS update improve framerate issues for games???

#21Rurouni720(Topic Creator)Posted 3/29/2013 10:13:17 PM
Damn. >.<

How about Monster Hunter 3U though? Unless you didn't get the 3DS copy yet, of course?
#22gransPosted 3/29/2013 10:24:49 PM(edited)
I just refought Wargoyle as Riku in City of Bells. Another boss battle that had absolutely DREADFUL framerate issues pre-update. Again, wow what an improvement. There's one attack he does in particular where he shoots a ton of multicolored crystals at you, it never failed to bring the game to an absolute crawl. And by crawl, I mean literal single digits of a framerate, no exaggeration. He always seems to start out the battle with this attack and you have to block it. And i've got late game abilities and attacks by now (with late game Dream Eaters too), my guard move in particular surrounds me with a transparent aura that would normally wreak even more damage to the game's performance. Now the attack is almost completely devoid of any slowdown. 4 times out of 5 he performed the attack in fact, the game didn't even lag at all. The fifth time there were a ton of other effects happening onscreen and it lagged slightly. Still was absolutely nothing compared to how choppy it was before.

Funny story but this battle holds a place in my mind because some of the first footage of the near-final game we had was this battle and the world around it. I remember seeing the game chug like crazy during this attack right at the start of the battle with and it wasn't a very good first impression (turned out to be a pretty fair worry in my head). It's the kind of choppiness I wouldn't easily forget-
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CFS3p4-4TDc

Seeing this battle play at such a smooth rate is especially rewarding.

From: Sagadego | #020
I updated my system. just tried DOAD still 30 frames per second in 3d sadly.

Does the framerate still drop during cutscenes? It actually dropped below 30fps outside of battles. If a game is specifically locked at a certain rate, then it probably won't perform any better with a system update. DOA probably was designed specifically NOT to run any faster than 30fps in 3D mode, which may be why it doesn't experience any improvement from this update.

This update seems to improve games that dropped lower than their intended rate. KH3D for instance is supposed to run at 30fps. But during intense battles and spell effects with a lot happening onscreen, the game can stutter well below that rate, despite it being clearly supposed to run at a higher rate. The update seems to have done something that helps it maintain its 30fps base rate, the game doesn't appear to become as choppy in general and the game can take a lot more abuse before you will see any lag. You will see some here and there, but the lag the game suffered from used to basically be constant. Outside of the smaller areas where nothing was happening onscreen, it was relatively rare to see the game running at its intended solid 30fps.

So any game that is locked at a fixed rate may not be improved by this update anyways. Games that are simply inconsistent in their framerate problems such as KH3D, apparently Sonic Racing and perhaps even Rayman 3D might see some improvement. They aren't capped at an inherently low rate, they simply drop below their intended rate (either 30fps or 60fps). Other games however may simply be designed specifically not to go higher than a certain framerate. Like DOA running at 30fps in 3D mode is probably an intentional cap that couldn't be easily disabled (at least not without some sort of patch or hack to unlock the framerate cap). I also wonder about Snake Eater 3D, its framerate is at a steadily low rate and may not see any improvement either. Perhaps the cutscenes, but the gameplay consistently runs at about 20fps or so and doesn't really get any better. It might fix the parts where it drops below that rate, but probably won't help much to get it higher than a supposed framerate cap.
---
NEVER judge a game you have not played.
-Granville
#23Vheissu84Posted 3/29/2013 10:23:09 PM
I've noticed some improvement on my games as well. Most notably Bit.trip Saga when playing runner. I haven't tested all the games yet, but in world 1 levels 10 and 11 had framerate drops so bad it was hard to even play. (Even with 3d off) I'm proud to say those levels are buttery smooth for me now, here's to hoping it stays that way.
---
GT- Vheissu84 PSN - Vheissu84
Owns: 360,3DS,PC and one hell of a backlog.
#24Rurouni720(Topic Creator)Posted 3/29/2013 10:44:19 PM
Ugghh yeah, DITTO on Wargoyle's part with Riku. Everytime the fight starts with it throwing crystal projectiles at your face the single digit FPS drops sceews me up BADILY ffom time to time.

So glad it's fixed now after such wonderful discovery LOL! First the final bosses, then Commantis, now Wargoyle....this night just keeps on getting better and better!

And yeah that may explain DoA's case for the 3D cap. if it,was intended compared to other 3DS games that fell to their knees in performance values. Damn it i wish someone would give update on Casrlevania's situation, because THAT game never goes anywhere but mixed to lower than 24FPS even with non-intensive factors on screen. :/
#25SagadegoPosted 3/29/2013 10:47:56 PM
grans posted...
I just refought Wargoyle as Riku in City of Bells. Another boss battle that had absolutely DREADFUL framerate issues pre-update. Again, wow what an improvement. There's one attack he does in particular where he shoots a ton of multicolored crystals at you, it never failed to bring the game to an absolute crawl. And by crawl, I mean literal single digits of a framerate, no exaggeration. He always seems to start out the battle with this attack and you have to block it. And i've got late game abilities and attacks by now (with late game Dream Eaters too), my guard move in particular surrounds me with a transparent aura that would normally wreak even more damage to the game's performance. Now the attack is almost completely devoid of any slowdown. 4 times out of 5 he performed the attack in fact, the game didn't even lag at all. The fifth time there were a ton of other effects happening onscreen and it lagged slightly. Still was absolutely nothing compared to how choppy it was before.

Funny story but this battle holds a place in my mind because some of the first footage of the near-final game we had was this battle and the world around it. I remember seeing the game chug like crazy during this attack right at the start of the battle with and it wasn't a very good first impression (turned out to be a pretty fair worry in my head). It's the kind of choppiness I wouldn't easily forget-
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CFS3p4-4TDc

Seeing this battle play at such a smooth rate is especially rewarding.

From: Sagadego | #020
I updated my system. just tried DOAD still 30 frames per second in 3d sadly.

Does the framerate still drop during cutscenes? It actually dropped below 30fps outside of battles. If a game is specifically locked at a certain rate, then it probably won't perform any better with a system update. DOA probably was designed specifically NOT to run any faster than 30fps in 3D mode, which may be why it doesn't experience any improvement from this update.

This update seems to improve games that dropped lower than their intended rate. KH3D for instance is supposed to run at 30fps. But during intense battles and spell effects with a lot happening onscreen, the game can stutter well below that rate, despite it being clearly supposed to run at a higher rate. The update seems to have done something that helps it maintain its 30fps base rate, the game doesn't appear to become as choppy in general and the game can take a lot more abuse before you will see any lag. You will see some here and there, but the lag the game suffered from used to basically be constant. Outside of the smaller areas where nothing was happening onscreen, it was relatively rare to see the game running at its intended solid 30fps.

So any game that is locked at a fixed rate may not be improved by this update anyways. Games that are simply inconsistent in their framerate problems such as KH3D, apparently Sonic Racing and perhaps even Rayman 3D might see some improvement. They aren't capped at an inherently low rate, they simply drop below their intended rate (either 30fps or 60fps). Other games however may simply be designed specifically not to go higher than a certain framerate. Like DOA running at 30fps in 3D mode is probably an intentional cap that couldn't be easily disabled (at least not without some sort of patch or hack to unlock the framerate cap). I also wonder about Snake Eater 3D, its framerate is at a steadily low rate and may not see any improvement either. Perhaps the cutscenes, but the gameplay consistently runs at about 20fps or so and doesn't really get any better. It might fix the parts where it drops below that rate, but probably won't help much to get it higher than a supposed framerate cap.


I think the cutscenes were done that way? so yes.
---
Why did Nintendo rip off digimon?- Demondog666
#26gransPosted 3/29/2013 11:03:52 PM(edited)
Mirror of Fate could be improved yes. The demo certainly isn't but I believe someone in another topic said they had the full game and it was improved from the update. It has some incredibly nasty framerate drops and jittering that would be great to be gotten rid of. And it doesn't seem to be capped at an inherently low framerate either, it clearly CAN reach 30fps when there's nothing happening onscreen in certain areas. So the potential to run well is there.

I still don't know why the demos seem unaffected, at least the ones i tried that other people said the full game was improved anyways. Pretty odd.

From: Sagadego | #025
I think the cutscenes were done that way? so yes.

Likely then that certain parts of the game are simply capped at a certain rate. No amount of OS-level tweaks or even a CPU/GPU overclock would be likely to help that. This update improves games that drop below a standard rate to an extent, but it's not going to help if a game was designed specifically not to play smoother. I would guess that DOA is locked at 30fps during 3D mode and whatever rate used during cutscenes. This update seems to help games run better within their framerate lock.

Again, this is why i'm inclined to think Snake Eater 3D won't see any substantial improvement from this update. The game was deliberately capped at a low framerate. Regardless of how much or how little action occurs onscreen, 20fps seems to be the maximum the game is able to run. Digital Foundry did a framerate analysis video on the game and it never went any faster than 20fps in either gameplay or cutscenes, that rate appears to be the maximum cap the developers programmed for the game. Now the game does experience dips well under that rate quite frequently, their video analysis shows drops down to 14fps at times (and in other places outside the demo it has been shown to have drops even into the single digits). The update could theoretically correct or somewhat alleviate the times where the game drops below its 20fps cap. Not saying it does for sure, but it could. The demo at least doesn't run any better than it did before (though again, neither apparently does the Sonic Racing game and yet people have reported the full game runs considerably better than pre update).
---
NEVER judge a game you have not played.
-Granville
#27MrDrippyPosted 3/29/2013 10:55:52 PM
I'm going to try MGS 3D later. >__>
---
http://i.imgur.com/R8gpXAg.jpg
#28gransPosted 3/29/2013 11:01:44 PM
From: MrDrippy | #027
I'm going to try MGS 3D later. >__>

Thanks, I assume you mean the full game. If you need a point of reference, the demo hasn't improved any as I said and you could compare the full game to that. And you can also compare it to Digital Foundry's framerate analysis as well if necessary-
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o9E42_QBq-c

I don't expect the game to break 20fps as that seems to be the cap, but it might lessen the frequent drops below 20fps.
---
NEVER judge a game you have not played.
-Granville
#29Rurouni720(Topic Creator)Posted 3/29/2013 11:10:20 PM(edited)
I still kinda wish the cutscene performance in all of KH3D's had a boost since the lag (especially in a couple places with 3D on despite dipping both ways) is still present among most of them. It boggles me mind how S.E. could let such an issue pass compared to their previous KH titles that held well performance wise, besides BBS since which happened to push the PSP to it's limits. Unlike KH3D's case considering it's engine that was utilized for the PSP shouldn't be pushing the 3DS to it's limits.

Not that i'm totally complaining since the fact that we got better FPS at in-game after the post-update is glorious because KH3D really needed one to boot.

But yes, totally agreed on Castlevania's case. No way in hell should a game like that be dropping all over the place as a standard due to piss poor optimization.
#30MrDrippyPosted 3/29/2013 11:13:27 PM
grans posted...
From: MrDrippy | #027
I'm going to try MGS 3D later. >__>

Thanks, I assume you mean the full game. If you need a point of reference, the demo hasn't improved any as I said and you could compare the full game to that. And you can also compare it to Digital Foundry's framerate analysis as well if necessary-
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o9E42_QBq-c

I don't expect the game to break 20fps as that seems to be the cap, but it might lessen the frequent drops below 20fps.


Yeah I have the full game.

I'll keep you guys updated.
---
http://i.imgur.com/R8gpXAg.jpg