achievements and dlc suck

#51ultradavedPosted 4/14/2013 10:01:23 AM
I think that how you think about these things largely depends what kind of gamer you are. Personally, I used to be an obsessive completionist that wanted to squeeze every secret and sidequest out of a game. I call it 1000% a game. 100% is beating it and unlocking all major elements like modes, characters, endings, extra levels, etc. 1000% is beating it so thoroughly that there's nothing left to do- hitting level caps, finishing all sidequests, collecting all items, completing the bestiary, and so on. Depending on the game, they might be one and the same (most NES/SNES games).

Anyhow, DLC and trophies can be a bane to this kind of thinking or make it considerably less fun. Buying DLC seems necessary to "complete" a game to me, and the fact that it's all about money and not skill/time invested is stupid. While technically optional, it makes you either fork over more cash to finish your quest or forever know that there's more $%&@ that you never did.

For example, the Disgaea series offers all these extra characters that just about double the cost of the game if you want to unlock them all. When I bought Mortal Kombat 9 (didn't get it until all of the characters were out), it cost about $100 to get the game, online pass, 4 DLC characters, and costume packs (I normally don't bother with costumes but when you're that far in and another $5 will finish it out, screw it, might as well). In a Capcom fighter, you're looking at way more than that. Costumes are usually pointless, but again, you feel like you're missing out on part of a game unless you pay a fortune.

The only time day-one DLC really makes sense to me (while still being ethical) is as some sort of pre-order bonus or store-specific extra. While this still annoys me, it makes so much sense as a business tactic that I can't really fault the companies. If, that is, they make it available for free later on (like the extra characters in Tekken Tag 2) or unlockable by normal (reasonable) methods in-game or over time.

Trophies can be even worse since they may be unable to be gotten. That's complete BS. If I buy a game used and it's no longer popular online, it's impossible for me to get the online trophies unless I can con someone else into buying the game and playing X matches against me. That sucks.

Other trophies may be more trouble than they're worth It's a rare game that I'm going to do a speed-run or no-damage clear attempt. I guess it might be nice for people who were already planning them but I'd prefer that they just stuck to stuff that a die-hard would do and not a require complete zealotry.

I generally like things like combo trainers and challenge levels/missions. I generally don't like things like "beat the game in 6 hours" or any kind of online achievement. Games like Super Smash Bros. Melee and Final Fantasy X do a fine job of having achievements available for view in-game. It takes 3 seconds to prove you have everything. Well, FFX doesn't technically, but having all summons and fully-powered ultimate weapons plus the mark for killing Nemesis is proof of pretty every sidequest. I guess it doesn't keep track of NSGXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX runs but I already said I hate those.

Anyway, many people don't care about stuff like this so they aren't bothered, but in that case it doesn't add anything for them so it's still pointless. Some of us are driven up the wall if the DLC is too expensive/numerous and the trophies can't be achieved (online after-the-fact) or are patently un-fun. Seems like there are only a tiny fraction of gamers who are excited about stuff like beating the game 100 times or 5 times in one day or whatever. They can still take screenshots or post videos on youtube for the even fewer people who care about their achievements.
#52shadyelfPosted 4/14/2013 10:07:48 AM
I don't care too much about DLC because I can wait until the inevitable GotY edition. Achievements are meh, I never go for them anyway.
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#53ultradavedPosted 4/14/2013 10:08:17 AM
BTW, i'm waiting for the total ass-hat move of combining the two and having "bought all DLC" as a trophy. Maybe this already exists but I haven't seen it.
#54n00bsaib0tPosted 4/14/2013 9:29:00 PM
deimos91 posted...
Awesomely Awesome AJ posted...
DLC is fine, people just blow **** out of proportion. If you don't like it then don't buy it,

Achievements are just extra so there is absolutely no reason to be pissed about it. I'd be more worried about multiplayer being shoehorned into games that don't need it


okay and it is ok the SFxT took out a third of the roster for on disk DLC


They didn't take them out. At no point was SFxTK going to be a base 55 character package. The 14 DLC characters were always going to be DLC. 12 of them were the super version. Capcom didn't cut content, they made the expansion before even releasing the core game. They got what they deserved for it too when it flopped.
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PSN/XBL- Nifterific
SSF4AE: Balrog, Evil Ryu | UMvC3: C.Viper/Morrigan/Hulk | MK9: Noob Saibot, Cyber Sub-Zero | SFxTK: Ryu/Guile
#55danielmgPosted 4/14/2013 9:41:17 PM
But the companies plan all the DLC out before they even start making the games now.
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#56ultradavedPosted 4/14/2013 11:52:27 PM
n00bsaib0t posted...
deimos91 posted...
Awesomely Awesome AJ posted...
DLC is fine, people just blow **** out of proportion. If you don't like it then don't buy it,

Achievements are just extra so there is absolutely no reason to be pissed about it. I'd be more worried about multiplayer being shoehorned into games that don't need it


okay and it is ok the SFxT took out a third of the roster for on disk DLC


They didn't take them out. At no point was SFxTK going to be a base 55 character package. The 14 DLC characters were always going to be DLC. 12 of them were the super version. Capcom didn't cut content, they made the expansion before even releasing the core game. They got what they deserved for it too when it flopped.


Six of one, half-a-dozen of another. If they have the content in-hand, then I feel like they could install or patch it into the initial purchase rather than partition it and make you pay more. That screwing you out of more ducats was their plan all along makes it worse, not better.

The kind of DLC I can stomach is the stuff they make after the fact and patch in later, like expansion and things. But day 1? %&#$ that.
#57n00bsaib0tPosted 4/15/2013 12:35:39 AM
ultradaved posted...
n00bsaib0t posted...
deimos91 posted...
Awesomely Awesome AJ posted...
DLC is fine, people just blow **** out of proportion. If you don't like it then don't buy it,

Achievements are just extra so there is absolutely no reason to be pissed about it. I'd be more worried about multiplayer being shoehorned into games that don't need it


okay and it is ok the SFxT took out a third of the roster for on disk DLC


They didn't take them out. At no point was SFxTK going to be a base 55 character package. The 14 DLC characters were always going to be DLC. 12 of them were the super version. Capcom didn't cut content, they made the expansion before even releasing the core game. They got what they deserved for it too when it flopped.


Six of one, half-a-dozen of another. If they have the content in-hand, then I feel like they could install or patch it into the initial purchase rather than partition it and make you pay more. That screwing you out of more ducats was their plan all along makes it worse, not better.

The kind of DLC I can stomach is the stuff they make after the fact and patch in later, like expansion and things. But day 1? %&#$ that.


Like I said, they got what they deserved for it.
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PSN/XBL- Nifterific
SSF4AE: Balrog, Evil Ryu | UMvC3: C.Viper/Morrigan/Hulk | MK9: Noob Saibot, Cyber Sub-Zero | SFxTK: Ryu/Guile
#58V1zdr1xPosted 4/15/2013 2:33:01 AM
DLCs are a mixed bag but most of the ones I've bought have sucked. I'll usually read a review of it to see if it's worth it but unless people are really blown away I usually tend not to get them.

Achievements on the other hand are just developers being lazy IMO. Instead of giving us unlockables they give us achievements points that do nothing for you and are tied to your console account. I split my gameplay between the PC and my consoles because I prefer playing certain games on one and different games on the other. That means that whatever achievements I get on steam aren't tied back to my consoles so I don't even pay attention to achievements anymore.

But also look at games last gen before achievements were cool. The example I'll use is RE4. You unlocked a new difficulty when you beat the game. You unlocked various game modes (Ada's mission, Separate Ways, Mercenaries) that if you completed would unlock items in the main game. That is how developers should incentivize their players to complete content. It seems like more and more games have less cool unlockables and more achievement points.