lol at Mario "fans" who are resistant to the series doing new things.

#31EnjuPosted 12/8/2012 8:59:20 PM
i actually fairly agree with the topic creator most of the complaints i've seen on this board are of people who don't like all the things that are different in this game from previous games

i like refinement as much as the next person and yes it does sometimes sadden me when elements are "taken" from games that i really enjoyed in their sequels but more than anything the game industry as a whole is about continuing innovation and i'd rather see great franchises like mario be willing to take risks in making new things than just stay forever as the classic 2D games, not that i don't still enjoy those games but i do wish that fans of mario games were a little less resistant to the series doing new things
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#32SpunkySixPosted 12/8/2012 10:01:25 PM
Enju posted...
i actually fairly agree with the topic creator most of the complaints i've seen on this board are of people who don't like all the things that are different in this game from previous games

i like refinement as much as the next person and yes it does sometimes sadden me when elements are "taken" from games that i really enjoyed in their sequels but more than anything the game industry as a whole is about continuing innovation and i'd rather see great franchises like mario be willing to take risks in making new things than just stay forever as the classic 2D games, not that i don't still enjoy those games but i do wish that fans of mario games were a little less resistant to the series doing new things


Yeah, refinement is good. The aspects being criticized are not refinements because they are examples of poor design or making the series more bland. I fail to see how this is positive.

Good change = good

Bad change = bad
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#33jayj420Posted 12/9/2012 1:43:18 AM
Mario fans aren't resistant to change, it's just the hardcore fanboys who populate online forums that are resistant to change. This is why Miyamoto ignores fanboys these days, he has the good sense to know when they're hurting the industry and should be ignored.
#34SpunkySixPosted 12/9/2012 4:58:26 AM
jayj420 posted...
Mario fans aren't resistant to change, it's just the hardcore fanboys who populate online forums that are resistant to change. This is why Miyamoto ignores fanboys these days, he has the good sense to know when they're hurting the industry and should be ignored.


You don't even understand why people are annoyed. You don't even understand what Miyamoto did. Either lurk more, look up some facts or stop whining about so-called "fanboys". Thanks.
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#35Knux19Posted 12/9/2012 6:23:47 AM
The glory of Mario is that he's so versatile, he can do just about anything and make it work somehow. He could be off on a plotless platformer and make it work as a more traditional game. The list of such games is enormous, but eventually, you want to try something different. Mario has a party game outlet for competitive mini-games, several puzzle games throughout release and even RPG branches for when Nintendo wants to tell a story.

Paper Mario was one such outlet. It allowed Mario to escape the string of platformers where the story was really no more complicated than "Peach gone! Bowser bad! You go get!". Mario could visit locations with a colorful cast of characters who could join his ranks, provide support and he wouldn't have to save the world all on his own (he's just a poor plumber!).

Now, that in mind, let me turn this topic around. Instead of going forward with a series that let Mario have a plot, we're going backwards with less story (quite bare bones) and a simplified battle system with no real strategic merits. If this were a game made 16 years or so ago to test the water for a Mario RPG, that might be a good start. However, such a game does exist sixteen years ago. It was called Mario RPG: Legend of the Seven Stars, and while I think that game is sorely overrated, it does a MUCH better job of being an RPG, stringing along it's narrative and even doing some basic platforming here and there.

Of course, that was sixteen years ago. I'd like to think Nintendo is holding themselves to a higher standard today.

So, while some people are getting indignant and uppity about others having problems with the game supposedly moving forward and trying new things, understand this: it's just as easy to see you satisfied with the game moving backwards and falling on old standards. If Nintendo wants more platforming and less story....then why wasn't this another New Super Mario Brothers?
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#36shakekingpwnerPosted 12/9/2012 7:02:38 AM
I'm surprised no one has mentioned mute Bowser. As far as removals from the series go I'd say that was the worst one because it was completely unnecessary, could've easily been avoided by just giving him a few lines here and there, and his smart-ass comic relief adds to the charm in Paper Mario titles tremendously.
#37BrianCraigSmithPosted 12/9/2012 8:27:04 AM
wiiking96 posted...
Paper Mario was an entirely new sub series at the time made by a different developer than SMRPG, expecting a true sequel to that game would just be wishful thinking. People in general are resistant to negative change, not just change in general. I'm freaking tired of people being so close minded in this issue.


The negative part says it all. The "advice" Kersti gives sucks, and the partner system from TTYD was better IMO.
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#38SpunkySixPosted 12/9/2012 9:35:07 AM
shakekingpwner posted...
I'm surprised no one has mentioned mute Bowser. As far as removals from the series go I'd say that was the worst one because it was completely unnecessary, could've easily been avoided by just giving him a few lines here and there, and his smart-ass comic relief adds to the charm in Paper Mario titles tremendously.


That would involve having a story, and apparently that would be way too complex for the general public to handle. Less than 1% of Nintendo's skewed poll liked story, so why even have it?
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#39jayj420Posted 12/9/2012 5:57:11 PM(edited)
SpunkySix posted...
jayj420 posted...
Mario fans aren't resistant to change, it's just the hardcore fanboys who populate online forums that are resistant to change. This is why Miyamoto ignores fanboys these days, he has the good sense to know when they're hurting the industry and should be ignored.


You don't even understand why people are annoyed. You don't even understand what Miyamoto did. Either lurk more, look up some facts or stop whining about so-called "fanboys". Thanks.


No, I understand perfectly, which is why I "whine" about the fanboys (who are one of the biggest group of whiners on the face of the earth). It is you who doesn't understand.
#40jayj420Posted 12/9/2012 6:10:11 PM
Knux19 posted...
So, while some people are getting indignant and uppity about others having problems with the game supposedly moving forward and trying new things, understand this: it's just as easy to see you satisfied with the game moving backwards and falling on old standards.


Actually no, you are completely wrong. If Sticker Star was like TTYD I would have never bought it because I thought TTYD was the worst direction that Nintendo could take with Paper Mario. It had too much emphasis on the story, and it wouldn't have worked as well as a portable game. This is one of those situations where the demands of a niche group of hardcore fanboys would have made the game less enjoyable for everyone else.

Luckily, Nintendo has stopped designing games around such a hardcore crowd after learning the hard way how their desires can ultimately hurt sales and turn everyone who isn't a hardcore gamer away. The Wii was successful because Nintendo stopped catering to hardcore fanboys and focused on making their games more accessible, and that is exactly what they did with Sticker Star.