Nobody on this board should review a video game. Ever.

#21Chaosmaster00Posted 1/23/2013 11:58:44 PM(edited)
I'm unable to discern the true intentions of creating this topic... thus, I state:

I am confuss.
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#22JHH62Posted 1/24/2013 12:02:47 AM
Chaosmaster00 posted...
I'm unable to discern the true intentions of creating this topic... thus, I state:

I am confuss.


I also find it funny how he named this topic "nobody on this board should review a video game ever" and the only way he backs it up is by saying sticker star is good
#23super_luigi16Posted 1/24/2013 12:16:01 AM
Czar_Yoshi posted...
However, they don't do very much to bosses.


Most "normal" stickers can do quite a lot in battle. For instance, Tails can do a lot against Bowser Jr. Burnhammers can do a lot against Ice Bowser. Any normal sticker does quite a bit of damage to Petey. Of course they're not as good as Things, but that's somewhat the point of the hierarchy.

Now that I've established all that (if you believe any of the above is wrong enough to invalidate my argument, feel free to point it out), think about this: if battling enemies takes stickers and gives coins and (fewer) stickers, but you already get loads of stickers in the overworld and coins don't buy anything you need if you don't battle (except secret doors, but you only need one of those), what do you get from battling?


Again, coins are used to buy more stickers. One perfect bonus can buy more than enough stickers to make up for whatever stickers you used in battle; on top of that, battles offer very powerful enemy stickers that tend to be even better than stickers like the Flashy Fire/Ice Flower. The Boomerang, Bomb, Barrel, Ninja Star, and Snowball are all hugely useful in practically any battle--small or large. Secondly, the coin incentive is pretty large. Like you said, you can buy Secret Doors, you can upgrade stickers, you can buy Things, if you'd rather not retrace/backtrack, and you can buy stickers for upcoming battles. Also, I do have to say that you'd spend much more time trying to outmaneuver/run from every battle than actually battling through everything. Progressing through the game is a rather large incentive to battle just as progressing through the game is a rather large incentive to battle in TTYD, PM, etc.

The answer cannot have anything to do with fun. Fun is subjective and does not apply to everyone.


So... you said all of that to say that you cannot objectively prove that battles have no incentive because they can be fun? That was exactly my point in the first place--you cannot objectively prove that there is no incentive (a) because of the above reasons I stated and (b) because the battles can be fun. Just because you subjectively don't have fun doesn't mean that the game objectively has no incentive. Maybe the incentive for me is to have fun (among the other, aforementioned reasons, as well)?
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#24Czar_YoshiPosted 1/24/2013 12:46:45 AM
super_luigi16 posted...
Again, coins are used to buy more stickers. One perfect bonus can buy more than enough stickers to make up for whatever stickers you used in battle;


Yes, coins are very easy to get. So even if you should need some, you can get them very quickly.

on top of that, battles offer very powerful enemy stickers that tend to be even better than stickers like the Flashy Fire/Ice Flower. The Boomerang, Bomb, Barrel, Ninja Star, and Snowball are all hugely useful in practically any battle--small or large.


Snowball and boomerang are useful, but why would I use a bomb, bone or ninja star when I'm overflowing with shiny iron jumps?

Secondly, the coin incentive is pretty large. Like you said, you can buy Secret Doors, you can upgrade stickers, you can buy Things, if you'd rather not retrace/backtrack, and you can buy stickers for upcoming battles.


Secret doors are a one-time cash drop, just like that Heart Piece in Twilight Princess that you need to donate many rupees to the old man in Hyrule Castle Town for.

As I said before, between things not needed for puzzles and stickers laying around, you have more than enough to fight with- even if you kill every single enemy. I did this, and I had more of a problem with my album being too full to be honest (and I never used a shop short of getting museum stuff and prepping for bosses).

Also, I do have to say that you'd spend much more time trying to outmaneuver/run from every battle than actually battling through everything. Progressing through the game is a rather large incentive to battle just as progressing through the game is a rather large incentive to battle in TTYD, PM, etc.


While that is an incentive, battling enemies to get them out of your way is for forced encounters. There should be reasons to fight beyond "hurr I'mma in your way what you gonna do about it!?!?!?" That gets old fast when it's the only reason to fight.

So... you said all of that to say that you cannot objectively prove that battles have no incentive because they can be fun?


What? I said you can't use "they're fun" to objectively prove that battles have an incentive because fun is subjective.

If I were the hater you make my side out to be, I would have flamed you for misinterpreting that. I'm not. Now remember this next time you want to call someone a hater for disagreeing with you.
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#25Chaosmaster00Posted 1/24/2013 12:50:32 AM
super_luigi16 posted...
Most "normal" stickers can do quite a lot in battle. For instance, Tails can do a lot against Bowser Jr. Burnhammers can do a lot against Ice Bowser. Any normal sticker does quite a bit of damage to Petey. Of course they're not as good as Things, but that's somewhat the point of the hierarchy.

Tail against Bowser Jr is, as you may not realize, his weakness. It may not be a Thing, but that's its role, being given in great quantities in 6-2. Same thing with Burnhammer. Your argument against his points, as such, are verily imvalidated, and only help to further the point that weaknesses as a whole make this game either too easy if used or challenging when not used.

Again, coins are used to buy more stickers. One perfect bonus can buy more than enough stickers to make up for whatever stickers you used in battle; on top of that, battles offer very powerful enemy stickers that tend to be even better than stickers like the Flashy Fire/Ice Flower. The Boomerang, Bomb, Barrel, Ninja Star, and Snowball are all hugely useful in practically any battle--small or large. Secondly, the coin incentive is pretty large. Like you said, you can buy Secret Doors, you can upgrade stickers, you can buy Things, if you'd rather not retrace/backtrack, and you can buy stickers for upcoming battles. Also, I do have to say that you'd spend much more time trying to outmaneuver/run from every battle than actually battling through everything. Progressing through the game is a rather large incentive to battle just as progressing through the game is a rather large incentive to battle in TTYD, PM, etc.


The fact that the game can be completed without purchasing a single sticker (bar the single Secret Door for the Fishhook) pretty much proves the uselessness of coins outside the battle spinner, and you can easily get enough coins for using that by selling junk stickers or from the field. Also, I laugh at the thought of any enemy sticker, sans Boomerang or Snowball, being thought as worth more than a Flashy Flower in combat. Besides those two mentioned, none of the others can compare in damage or effectiveness, and aside from Bomb, all the others not mentioned by myself only even hit one enemy, which works against your abilities as the player to gain Perfect bonuses, which inhibits your effectiveness to gain coins from battles.

So... you said all of that to say that you cannot objectively prove that battles have no incentive because they can be fun? That was exactly my point in the first place--you cannot objectively prove that there is no incentive (a) because of the above reasons I stated and (b) because the battles can be fun. Just because you subjectively don't have fun doesn't mean that the game objectively has no incentive. Maybe the incentive for me is to have fun (among the other, aforementioned reasons, as well)?

Dude, you obviously have little or no reading comprehension, because the post you quoted had literally proved there was little to no objective reasons to fight non-required battles. Also, your reasons are indeed subjective, as stated, you o NOT have to purchase any stickers to beat the game (save one required purchase), therefore outside of the battle spinner and the subjectively optional Super Flag, coins have almost no true purpose for collection and use in this game.

If the incentive for you to battle is fun, then that's a subjective reason, not an objective one, by the way. Learn the difference between subjective and objective before you argue yourself into another corner.
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#26SpunkySixPosted 1/24/2013 5:01:08 AM
What does Luigi not understand about Hopslipper spam + waekness being the only cost effective strategy for most bosses? The way he just keeps pretending like any other strategy matters is ridiculous. Bowser and Ice Bowser are special cases. Petey is super weak to the Hopslipper spam even. Heck, even a POKEY can be easily beaten with Hopslippers.

And no, I shouldn't have to not buy certain basic items for fear of breaking the game. If I have to intentionally avoid purchasing low level, readily available stickers in order to make the game fun, the system is stupid broken to begin with. It's not like wasting coins and HP and time is any fun.
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#27Crazy_tank51Posted 1/24/2013 8:00:52 AM
SpunkySix posted...
What does Luigi not understand about Hopslipper spam + waekness being the only cost effective strategy for most bosses? The way he just keeps pretending like any other strategy matters is ridiculous. Bowser and Ice Bowser are special cases. Petey is super weak to the Hopslipper spam even. Heck, even a POKEY can be easily beaten with Hopslippers.

And no, I shouldn't have to not buy certain basic items for fear of breaking the game. If I have to intentionally avoid purchasing low level, readily available stickers in order to make the game fun, the system is stupid broken to begin with. It's not like wasting coins and HP and time is any fun.


This, I didn't have to avoid certain items/badges for fear of breaking PM. And no one is to mention Danger Mario because that's a pro set-up (either easy kill or easy death, depends on how good u are) plus try doing it with no Life Shrooms/Repel Gels and tell me how viable it is for the everyday gamer.

Hopslipper and Infinijump, on the other hand, are capable of putting out damage that puts many other MegaFlashes and even some Things to shame, are cheap and easily availible (Infinijump less so) and require virtually no skill. Just timing. The game is basically Flashy Flower/Shell/Boomerang on common enemies, Hopslipper on individual enemies. That's it. What fun.
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#28super_luigi16Posted 1/24/2013 8:11:22 AM
Chaosmaster00 posted...
Tail against Bowser Jr is, as you may not realize, his weakness. It may not be a Thing, but that's its role, being given in great quantities in 6-2. Same thing with Burnhammer. Your argument against his points, as such, are verily imvalidated, and only help to further the point that weaknesses as a whole make this game either too easy if used or challenging when not used.


I do know that the Tail is Bowser Jr. is his weakness. The point was that normal stickers are useful in boss battles, even if they exploit weaknesses. They're not useless in boss battles, and most powerful normal stickers work well against any boss. Obviously you missed the point--I was not arguing that you don't need to exploit the boss' weaknesses; rather, that you can use normal stickers in boss battles effectively.

The fact that the game can be completed without purchasing a single sticker (bar the single Secret Door for the Fishhook) pretty much proves the uselessness of coins outside the battle spinner, and you can easily get enough coins for using that by selling junk stickers or from the field. Also, I laugh at the thought of any enemy sticker, sans Boomerang or Snowball, being thought as worth more than a Flashy Flower in combat. Besides those two mentioned, none of the others can compare in damage or effectiveness, and aside from Bomb, all the others not mentioned by myself only even hit one enemy, which works against your abilities as the player to gain Perfect bonuses, which inhibits your effectiveness to gain coins from battles.


At each point in the game, those enemy stickers are some of the strongest stickers available. Obviously the Ninja Star or Sombrero are not going to be as powerful as the Flashy Fire Flower just as the Normal Jump is not as powerful as the late-game Flashy Jump. At each respective point in the game, enemy stickers prove time and time again that they are some of the strongest stickers available; Sombreros deal far more damage than most stickers in World 2; Ninja Stars deal far more damage than most stickers in World 3; the Snowball is an established guillotine in World 4; Boomerangs can kill in any world. If you don't want to battle for enemy stickers, battle for coins. Yes, you're going to need coins for the Battle Spinner, for Things, and for sticker restocks. I doubt you're going to be overflowing with enough cash to buy all of those Flashy Fire Flowers that you so desperately want. And of course this game can be beaten without battling--so can nearly every other game. That's why Lvl 1 Critical Runs exist.

If the incentive for you to battle is fun, then that's a subjective reason, not an objective one, by the way. Learn the difference between subjective and objective before you argue yourself into another corner.


Of which I just countered. Rather than resorting to ad hominems--questioning my ability to read of all things--you should focus on reading what I'm saying. You cannot objectively prove that there is no incentive to battle unless you can objectively prove that no one can have fun with this game. Unless you can do that--in which case, I would be very impressed--you cannot objectively prove that there is incentive to battle. All you've proven then is that you have no fun battling and that is a subjective dislike that proves nothing.
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Luigi > Mario
Current Project
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#29super_luigi16Posted 1/24/2013 8:21:29 AM
Czar_Yoshi posted...
What? I said you can't use "they're fun" to objectively prove that battles have an incentive because fun is subjective.

If I were the hater you make my side out to be, I would have flamed you for misinterpreting that. I'm not. Now remember this next time you want to call someone a hater for disagreeing with you.


But you can't prove that there is no fun to be had. Hence, you can't objectively prove that there is no incentive--some people, maybe most people, might have fun battling. Hence, you're entire argument to prove that there is no objective reason to battle--which itself is rather dubious and fails to take into account the idea of progression and the use of powerful enemy stickers--hinges on everyone subjectively disliking the game. Even if you could prove that there is no objective reason to battle--which there is--, you would still have to prove that there is no subjective reason to want to battle because that's an incentive. If you want to argue against opinions, be my guest.

Crazy_tank51 posted...
This, I didn't have to avoid certain items/badges for fear of breaking PM. And no one is to mention Danger Mario because that's a pro set-up (either easy kill or easy death, depends on how good u are) plus try doing it with no Life Shrooms/Repel Gels and tell me how viable it is for the everyday gamer.

Hopslipper and Infinijump, on the other hand, are capable of putting out damage that puts many other MegaFlashes and even some Things to shame, are cheap and easily availible (Infinijump less so) and require virtually no skill. Just timing. The game is basically Flashy Flower/Shell/Boomerang on common enemies, Hopslipper on individual enemies. That's it. What fun.


What I don't get is how people seem to think that you're just going to stumble across every combo on your first playthrough. I didn't even know about Hopslipper or Infinijump whoring until after I beat the game once. So, are you going to tell me that 99% of people playing are going to discover Hopslipper/Infinijump? Hell no. Ninety-nine percent of people likely aren't. And if you want to try to search out enough Flashy Fire Flowers, Shells, Boomerangs, Hopslippers, and Infinijumps to power through the game, go right ahead. Guess that makes an incentive to battle, if you want to buy all of those stickers. I guarantee you're going to spend far more time trying to make the game easier than you would've if you had just battled your way through. Every game is breakable and I fail to see what you're point if you want to sit there and argue that SS is somehow more breakable than other games. If you want to suck the fun out of a game by spending so much time to break it, then you're not really reflective of the average person playing through the game. Your experience is rather fringe when the vast majority of people aren't wasting time farming specific stickers.
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Luigi > Mario
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#30Chaosmaster00Posted 1/24/2013 8:37:07 AM
super_luigi16 posted...
But you can't prove that there is no fun to be had. Hence, you can't objectively prove that there is no incentive--


Religion logic always immediately cancels your validity beyond the point it's mentioned.

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