Everybody on this board should review video games. Always.

#1poptarts22Posted 1/24/2013 10:28:09 AM
This game gets complained about for the wrong reasons.

No story is fine.
No partners is fine.
Not being TYD or 64 is fine.

The problem is with the game mechanics themselves.

1) There is too big of a power difference between battle stickers and Thing stickers when it comes to bosses. It's okay to make bosses have weaknesses, but not to the point that it almost completely negates anything outside of infinijumps, especially when the game expects the player to have flung specific Things into stickers ahead of time. From there it becomes an issue of knowing when to use the specific thing stickers on top of already having them (i.e. the sponge right before the poison spit). Yes, you can get specific hints from Kersti about the boss...after you die. In fact, needing to fling Things into stickers in the first place ends up hindering the entire mechanic in the first place, as cute as the dev team may have thought it was. This might be alleviated a bit if the game treated Things as permanent objects you retained in your inventory that simply required "Thing Points" (TP) to use.

2) 50% of the Thing stickers don't get used outside of contributing them to the museum. By the time you have enough sticker pages to justify carrying around multiple giant Thing stickers, the game is almost over, at which point you have also been taught to be punished for using any Thing that isn't the "right" Thing.

3) Many segments of game progression are locked behind invisible blocks and narrow passages in the background of the screen. It's okay to hide extra, fun goodies and secrets to games. It's not okay to hide game progression behind those things. It's a puzzle to decipher hieroglyphics in a temple. It's not a puzzle to jump at a specific spot (and this is outside of the invis blocks that have flowers underneath them as a clue) or walk behind a random bush that otherwise looks flat, even with 3D on. Imagine if you couldn't clear the original Super Mario Bros without knowing where the invisible 1-Up mushroom was on stage 1-1.

4) There is no meaningful reward for combat; therefore, there is no reason to get into combat. Prior to world 4, the amount of coins you get for defeating an enemy is negligible, especially when stickers are so abundant that the only thing you need to use coins on is black market Things and secret doors. The one saving grace of game design in this aspect is that battles aren't forced.

The only real point where the game hit it's stride was World 4; specifically, the Enigmansion. The puzzles had context, (fire) battle stickers were on par with Things in boss combat, and progression flowed extremely well.

Anyway, just wanted to get this out there, regardless of whether or not you agree with any of the points brought up. It's okay to defend a game, but it's frustrating to see a game being defended over the wrong reasons.

And, again, none of these things are game-breaking, they are just poor game design choices that could have easily been alleviated by a few tweaks to gameplay.

Sticker Star felt like it was too afraid of being an RPG, but when it drifted towards being a point and click puzzle adventure game, it didn't drift far enough and the final result was some hybrid that didn't incorporate proper game mechanics from EITHER genre.
#2SpunkySixPosted 1/24/2013 10:33:31 AM
Actually, lacking a story in a story based series isn't fine, and the lack of partners would be okay, except there was an easy way to implement them and make more people happy.

It is good that it isn't TTYD or 64 though, and I agree that the mechanics just flat out don't work too often.
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Tissue to the extreme!
We're the good guys, not you!
#3CopShow GuyPosted 1/24/2013 10:44:54 AM(edited)
It wasn't so much the lack of story that I was bothered with, it was the weakness of the story. Peach gets kidnapped by Bowser in the beginning and you don't hear from or about them until half way through the game (and that's just Bowser Jr. pestering you once). I honestly forgot about Peach and Bowser and was more focused on why these Things were scattered around the world.

Peach gets kidnapped and then you're working for Kersti for some unrelated reason.

They could have just called the game "Paper Mario: Sticker Adventure" and left Peach out all together.

That and the battle system was poorly done. Both boss battles and standard battles (which I began avoiding completely after world 1).
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#4poptarts22(Topic Creator)Posted 1/24/2013 12:14:21 PM
Regardless of your deep passions for story, story doesn't make or break a videogame. Gameplay does. A good story IS a nice thing to have as a cherry on top, but it's not the determining factor on whether or not I am having FUN. If story is more important than gameplay to you, try checking out these other things featuring paper: Books.
#5Bass50Posted 1/24/2013 1:49:21 PM
poptarts22 posted...
Regardless of your deep passions for story, story doesn't make or break a videogame. Gameplay does. A good story IS a nice thing to have as a cherry on top, but it's not the determining factor on whether or not I am having FUN. If story is more important than gameplay to you, try checking out these other things featuring paper: Books.


It does when the series is known for focusing on story. Unless you're saying that Square Enix could get away with releasing a FF game that focuses on the gameplay while the story becomes nothing more than an afterthought and it'd be a good game? Also, whether or not YOU'RE having fun doesn't really matter in the long term. I'm sure there were people that enjoyed Sonic '06 and had fun playing it; that doesn't make it a great game. Of course, if gameplay is the only thing important to you, I'm sure you could find an old NES or Master System to play and if not; there's always digital downloads of old games across various consoles. Or, you could just play Tetris, Solitaire or Minesweeper on your computer; they all have solid gameplay.

In video games today, story is usually as important as gameplay, just as music and graphics are equally important. A good balance makes a great game. If one of those aspects is sub par, the game can still be good; mainly if it's a flash game or phone game; console games suffer a bit more, though. If it's two, then the game can still be good, but it'll really have to shine in the two aspects it did right. More than two and it seems like it might be a fun game, but is really lacking, which is where SS falls.
#6SpunkySixPosted 1/24/2013 3:54:03 PM
poptarts22 posted...
Regardless of your deep passions for story, story doesn't make or break a videogame. Gameplay does. A good story IS a nice thing to have as a cherry on top, but it's not the determining factor on whether or not I am having FUN. If story is more important than gameplay to you, try checking out these other things featuring paper: Books.


In a series that emphasizes story, story is important. I never said it was MORE important than gameplay, but they aren't mutually exclusive and yeah, both are important. Books aren't the only media that can stimulate you intellectually, tell a story, and influence the experience heavily with said story, and if you think they are then maybe you should read up on story telling in other media. Story actually makes or breaks many games, (I'll list them if you want) taking them from just okay to amazing. I'm not paying $40 for good enough.

And also, "lol is not fun for me" is highly subjective. You should try this thing called, "immersion" it's really cool.
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Tissue to the extreme!
We're the good guys, not you!
#7GeneraLightPosted 1/24/2013 4:06:11 PM
Who are you to say story matters in a series with story? You don't need story in -any- game, regardless of what franchise it belongs to.
#8Mirror_AuraPosted 1/24/2013 4:17:45 PM
From: Bass50 | Posted: 1/24/2013 3:49:21 PM | #005
poptarts22 posted...
Regardless of your deep passions for story, story doesn't make or break a videogame. Gameplay does. A good story IS a nice thing to have as a cherry on top, but it's not the determining factor on whether or not I am having FUN. If story is more important than gameplay to you, try checking out these other things featuring paper: Books.

It does when the series is known for focusing on story. Unless you're saying that Square Enix could get away with releasing a FF game that focuses on the gameplay while the story becomes nothing more than an afterthought and it'd be a good game?

Paper Mario is not known for focusing on story, and Final Fantasy has had several non-story-focused entries, like 1, 5, etc.

I didn't bother reading the rest of your post. Story isn't nearly as important as you seem to think. :/
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#9Bass50Posted 1/24/2013 4:25:07 PM
GeneraLight posted...
Who are you to say story matters in a series with story? You don't need story in -any- game, regardless of what franchise it belongs to.


Ha! You're hilarious. "Story doesn't matter in a series that focuses on story" indeed. What's the matter, can't accept that video games have evolved beyond being storyless button pressing hobbies and have actually become something better? Really, they don't need stories, you say? Tell that to Square Enix, XSeed, Namco, etc. Maybe you shouldn't post when you have no idea what you're talking about.
#10wiiking96Posted 1/24/2013 4:26:02 PM
Mirror_Aura posted...
From: Bass50 | Posted: 1/24/2013 3:49:21 PM | #005
poptarts22 posted...
Regardless of your deep passions for story, story doesn't make or break a videogame. Gameplay does. A good story IS a nice thing to have as a cherry on top, but it's not the determining factor on whether or not I am having FUN. If story is more important than gameplay to you, try checking out these other things featuring paper: Books.

It does when the series is known for focusing on story. Unless you're saying that Square Enix could get away with releasing a FF game that focuses on the gameplay while the story becomes nothing more than an afterthought and it'd be a good game?

Paper Mario is not known for focusing on story

Yes it is.
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