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Isn't there something just so unappealingly lazy about so many religious claims?

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  3. Isn't there something just so unappealingly lazy about so many religious claims?

User Info: Fatestaykitchen

Fatestaykitchen
2 months ago#1
I mean don't get me wrong, the ones that aren't true are no doubt testaments to human imagination and creativity. In that regard it might paradoxically require more effort but that's not really a good sign. There's a saying that goes something like 'you don't need imagination to tell the truth' I'm well aware that the religious belief is pretty much a non sequitur to the subject individual intelligence. i'm also well aware that a lot of our greatest achievements intellectual or otherwise come from religious people or religious contexts. Even science itself has its roots in religious research. There are esoteric practices and scholars and all that s***. Of course religion can be has been and still is an intellectual pursuit.

Even still there's something inherently lazy about it perhaps now more than it used to be since you don't have an excuse now. Most of these books were written by people who didn't know most of the basic knowledge we take for granted today. A 5 year old probably knows more about the nature of the universe than the greatest scholars back then no matter how smart they were just because of the knowledge they were working with. So naturally the books written back then aren't going to have any of the answers to the questions that would be asked nowadays. All they could do was give their best guess, their most creative idea and the biggest of shrugs. That's what a lot of it amounts to. A big shrug and hand wave saying 'a wizard did it.....somehow. I can come up with a cool story about it if you want'

That 'somehow' is what bugs me. Saying "God made it' isn't an actual explanation. It's a handwave, a placeholder. I'm well aware that there are/were entire societies devoted to 'how exactly did God do it'? But that's just our scientific intuitions trying to do damage control to rationalize a crappy premise . Obviously people devoted a great deal of deep contemplation to this and they might have even hit on some deep fundamental truths but they simply weren't in a position to do any better than they did. It's like our first grade homework. Our infantile attempts at tackling these concepts with the best knowledge we had. They did pretty well. They were our masterpieces back then.

The laziness starts popping up when you start actually scrutinizing this claim and what it really means based on our knowledge. It comes down to 'God made the universe somehow and all this stuff like atoms. dark matter, the inevitable heat death of the universe , particle physics, supernovae , multiple galaxies just happened also somehow just because. Also for whatever reason he's concerned about some talking apes on a tiny planet orbiting a tiny star in one of the arms of some random Galaxy. Why isn't any of this s*** mentioned in the holy texts? No f***ing idea.' (Obviously there are other cosmogonies) You could probably come up with some creative ways to to incorporate this now but they would all be purely circular unfalsifiable attempts at rationalization. You could do that for literally anything and it often requires you to do Olympic level mental gymnastics to fit or just invalidate the whole thing by saying 'allegory and symbolism'

The worst part is that creationists will often use religion as the alternative to scientists 'not knowing the answer' like this is an intelligent alternative. b****, you have even less of an answer. This is the biggest non answer you can give. 'Some being that I don't really understand did stuff somehow for some reason' is just answering a question with another question.

It's basically a big 'I don't know' and in most people it's ' I don't care either'. A full on Carte Blanche for intellectual laziness. It strikes me as the laziest possible answer you can give here even as it demands you to work overtime to justify it if you even bother to. It's one of the only reasons I have such a bee in my bonnet about this topic at all, aside from policy issues. This applies more to the layperson obviously but that's the f***ing majority.
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User Info: OrangeWizard

OrangeWizard
2 months ago#2
It seems like you're criticizing religions for not explaining enough about the sciences.Why do you think that religions should even concern themselves with them?

Religions seek to answer a different set of questions: What is our purpose for being? How should we live? What comes after death?

I don't think it's fair to criticize religions for not being able to answer certain questions about physics, just as it's not fair to criticize a fish for not being able to climb a tree.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCevfumG9WSyr165n84HfwRQ

User Info: LinkFanatic

LinkFanatic
2 months ago#3
OrangeWizard posted...
I don't think it's fair to criticize religions for not being able to answer certain questions about physics, just as it's not fair to criticize a fish for not being able to climb a tree.


When we're talking about the God of the Abrahamic religions, it sure as hell is fair.
The first 2 forms of Cell flaunted his tail, like he's Ron Jeremy. But after he absorbed 18 his tail retracted and only seemed useful for reproducing. -Byron808

User Info: OrangeWizard

OrangeWizard
2 months ago#4
LinkFanatic posted...
OrangeWizard posted...
I don't think it's fair to criticize religions for not being able to answer certain questions about physics, just as it's not fair to criticize a fish for not being able to climb a tree.


When we're talking about the God of the Abrahamic religions, it sure as hell is fair.


I don't see how that works.

So you have an omnipotent God that created every facet of the universe. Who says he has to have it all explained in his book? Why is he obligated to hand all the answers to us on a silver platter?
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCevfumG9WSyr165n84HfwRQ

User Info: omnichaos

omnichaos
2 months ago#5
Because some basic unknown info about science would prove the legitimacy of said text. There's nothing of the sort in them, quite the opposite actually.

User Info: LinkFanatic

LinkFanatic
2 months ago#6
OrangeWizard posted...
I don't see how that works.


It's roundabout as f***, for one thing.
The first 2 forms of Cell flaunted his tail, like he's Ron Jeremy. But after he absorbed 18 his tail retracted and only seemed useful for reproducing. -Byron808

User Info: LinkFanatic

LinkFanatic
2 months ago#7
omnichaos posted...
Because some basic unknown info about science would prove the legitimacy of said text.


Nah, it wouldn't. At best, it would lend it a little credibility, that's all.
The first 2 forms of Cell flaunted his tail, like he's Ron Jeremy. But after he absorbed 18 his tail retracted and only seemed useful for reproducing. -Byron808

User Info: omnichaos

omnichaos
2 months ago#8
I would say a lot of credibility. I despise the fictional character of the god of Abraham, but if Genesis had an accurate description of how stars form and explained how the tides go in and out, I'd quickly be on the path to misotheism.

User Info: LinkFanatic

LinkFanatic
2 months ago#9
omnichaos posted...
I'd quickly be on the path to misotheism.


NICE :D
The first 2 forms of Cell flaunted his tail, like he's Ron Jeremy. But after he absorbed 18 his tail retracted and only seemed useful for reproducing. -Byron808

User Info: ManLink4321

ManLink4321
2 months ago#10
Don't listen to LinkFanatic, he's a huge troll on this board.
The Hero of Hyrule.
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