Why im soo glad they added TALON.

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  3. Why im soo glad they added TALON.

User Info: BlackEagle

BlackEagle
10 months ago#1
Now... You see... Soo many hate it when i join a lobby in my Talon helicopter.. But why? They act like talon is there as if its training wheels for noobs... Well... What they need to understand is that everybody has there Veichle of choice because its what reflects them... Everybody chooses a vehicle that represents them and there style. Well, my whole life i have always loved everything and anything that flys. Some people like cars, trucks, motorcycles, but i just choose to love things that fly... Particularly helicopters... And in every game i have ever owned i have always been an aerialist and love to be above ground.. Plus, i dont know if its just my extreme depth of perception but my abilities are hightened and are more skillfull in the sky i promise you. I navagate a helicopter like a formula one racecar driver drives his car... People think there is no skill when it comes to flying or Talon... But basically what it boils down too is that we are all different.... We all have our personal likings.... Mine has always been anything that gets off the ground specifically helicoptors. Soo let bygons be bygons and not judge because of someones vehicle.... Besides... They put talon on TM for reason... To widen the spectrum for people that love TM but also are restricted to what they have to drive. They were thinking about everybody as a whole.... Not whats fair and unfair.... They tried to please everybody from every liking in this game so that anybody can pick up this game and find the vehicle of there hearts desire without any restriction.

User Info: lcampoy

lcampoy
10 months ago#2
I admire you love of everything that is aerial based... I must mention that that if everyone paid attention that at a talon was in that sky and EVERYONE LOOKED UP FOR ONCE. Talon would not be as difficult as many pexpletive make him out to be. I've only lyrics known one player that usedan him to near perfection... sadly he doesn't play anymore. I wish more pexpletive were more executing of him.
3DS: 1220-8395-9035

User Info: BlackEagle

BlackEagle
10 months ago#3
lcampoy posted...
I admire you love of everything that is aerial based... I must mention that that if everyone paid attention that at a talon was in that sky and EVERYONE LOOKED UP FOR ONCE. Talon would not be as difficult as many pexpletive make him out to be. I've only lyrics known one player that usedan him to near perfection... sadly he doesn't play anymore. I wish more pexpletive were more executing of him.


Yeah, ever since i was able to play video games... I have always flown areial Vehicles... My very first game was Air Combat on ps1... And ever since then i have loved anything that flies... I know makes and models of aircraft that you have never heard of... But yes on twisted metal i wield talon like its an extention of my body... But unfortunately.... Everybody who creates there own lobby they always never allow the use of talon... Which again like i said previously in my first post thats not right because its biased... They put a helicopter on the game to please the taste of types... And i have always loved twisted metal but was always restricted to being in a 4 wheel machine... But when i saw that they offered the use a helicopter in combat.... That made my wish come true... But.. Far too often do i see people not making talon available in there lobbies.... Which is soo distasteful. And like you said... If they would up every once and a while... They would have more of an equal chance seeing how talon cant take but just a few hits.... Do to its medium range class helicopter.... Its average in size and fragile... Just like a real news helicopter... A Bell JetRanger.... Plus i always thought that it would add a little variety to other peoples lobbies... Because everybody is use to the same old thing... Shooting other vehicles on the ground... Why not mix it up a bit... You know...

User Info: lcampoy

lcampoy
10 months ago#4
I apoligize for the gammer mistake... and for future mistakes ....

Anyways, the reason that talon is made
Unavailable in unranked lobbies is it most veterans player believe that talon is broken/ creates an unfair or unbalanced game, which I totally disagree with. Like you said , not only would it add diversity to tm but it would challenge players as well. Again... like you said, it's incredibly fragile and doesn't pose that much of a problem that most are lead to believe.

Wow... just skimmed through myour first post.... f***ing autocorrect.
3DS: 1220-8395-9035

User Info: BlackEagle

BlackEagle
10 months ago#5
Haha yeah.... Hey.. Do you still play TM online?

User Info: MuddyMaestro

MuddyMaestro
10 months ago#6
The problem isn't whether Talon is balanced or not. The problem is that Talon is simply unfun to both fight as and against, because there's no skill involved and it only detracts from the depth of the game. How do you fight as Talon? Spam undodgeable weapons and hide. How do you fight against a Talon? Camp and wait for it to expose itself to slap remotes on it, and try to cut if off when it tries to go for health. It's boring as hell.

Talon isn't hard to shut down if you constantly pressure it, but if you give it an inch then it will take a mile, and simply spam you to death. It makes the game a war of attrition rather than a game of strategy and execution. It's the reason why all the Talon users have abandoned the game and why skilled players who don't believe Talon has a place in TM still play on a nightly basis, because ground based vehicles actually require skill and are fun.
This user is a proud Canadian.
PSN: Muddy_Maestro | XBL: Muddy Maestro

User Info: BlackEagle

BlackEagle
10 months ago#7
As i do respect your opinon. I do beg to differ... Yes some talon users fly it with the regards of cowardness... Me on the other hand isnt a p****.... And i always go head on with any enemy i come across.... Till death... Now whether or not you read the previous comments, i am a preferred aerialist and always have been and always will be.... Now you wouldnt understand that because you have a different preference.... We all have different preferences.... Which is what makes us all different.... Like i said in my earier comments.. They added talon for a since of diversity to give more variable options to a more expanded crowd to where anybody can pick up the game and pick the vehicle of there particular taste.... Muscle, japanese, exotic, the unusual, big rigs, motorcycle, the sinister, the under dogs, and of course the aerial.... They wanted to please to pallet of all and every type... Now... I have every single TW metal game of the series... And ever since i was a kid i loved the series.... But i have always been somebody who loves aviation... And when they finally came out with the last installment which featured a helicopter.... I was completly amazed... And you have to understand.... Im not the only one... Im sure there were thousands of others just like me out there waiting for something like this to happen... Which ergo probably increased there sales for sure.... Now... From my past of playing online... I never had any complaints from other players.... If anything talon shouldnt be that much of a challenge for you seeing how it has one of the lowest armor point ratings.... Talon in itself is an easy bird to shoot down... Its not hard... You aim up... Especially if you use the classic tw metal control option you can aim up very fast and easily with the right joystick.... And between a head to head full blown missle attack between a talon and a ground vehicle... The ground vehicle will always win because its armor surpasses talon 10 fold... Soo there shouldnt be any fear at all towards a talon... Unless its manned by a professional like myself... Now... What would make it unfair is that if they didnt make talon a crappy little fragile news helicopter which resembles a Bell Jetranger.... But if they made it into an actual gunship... Like an Apache AH-64 or a Russian Mig-23 or 25. But then that would defy the style of the game... All vehicles suppose to be civilian vehicles that are home made for combat... Ergo the news helicopter..... But.... What many people dont seem to complain about is sweet tooth... Seeing how he has very good armor.... And has the ability to fly... Making it an even more of a threat than any talon.... If anything sweet tooths sweet bot should be the outrage if anything... Not talon...

User Info: MuddyMaestro

MuddyMaestro
10 months ago#8
First, can I ask you to post your PSN ID(s)? I've played since the beta and would like to know if I recognize your name.

BlackEagle posted...
i always go head on with any enemy i come across.... Till death...

If that's the case, you must die a lot. Or, you're facing extremely incompetent players who don't bother targeting you. The fundamental principle of Talon is to be exposed as little as possible, and when you are exposed you should be hammering your opponent with undodgable spam, staggering them with weapons that have the capability to upset their vehicle, and absorbing their attacks to send stalkers back at them while banking whatever valuable pickups they sent your way. The common denominator is that Talon gameplay is spam with little to no aiming, maneuvering or strategy involved. It's just plain boring.

BlackEagle posted...
They added talon for a since of diversity to give more variable options to a more expanded crowd to where anybody can pick up the game and pick the vehicle of there particular taste....

There's a difference between having a diverse roster, and having vehicles that actually work with the game's concept and not make the gameplay more shallow. If Talon worked with the preexisting weapons system, then its inclusion would make sense, but it doesn't. All of the manual aim and skill-based weapons are rarely useful while playing as/fighting against Talon, whereas all the weapons that are most effective are auto-aim spam, hence stripping the game of depth.

BlackEagle posted...
Talon in itself is an easy bird to shoot down... Its not hard... You aim up..

If a Talon is flying above you in the open, then it's an easy target. But the fact is that a good Talon does not needlessly expose themselves. To be honest, your statement makes me think you never played against a competent Talon or only played during the era of auto-aim mega guns where a Talon/Sweet Bot didn't even need to worry about defence, and could just mow down any exposed enemy from full health in a matter of seconds with undodgeable mega guns. To be clear once again, the problem isn't whether Talon is balanced or not. The problem is that Talon is simply unfun to both fight as and against.

BlackEagle posted...
Unless its manned by a professional like myself...

Ooh, confidence. I like it. I'd love to play a 1v1 with you and see if I can best you then.

BlackEagle posted...
But.... What many people dont seem to complain about is sweet tooth... Seeing how he has very good armor.... And has the ability to fly... Making it an even more of a threat than any talon.... If anything sweet tooths sweet bot should be the outrage if anything... Not talon...

Sweet Bot used to be a problem for as long as the auto-aim mega guns existed, but it's much less of a threat now because it has practically zero potential for offence while flying. It can't fire any of its standard inventory in the air and the most it's capable of doing is to use mega guns on enemies who only camp/drive in a straight line, or sweet slam in crowded groups, plus its turbo is limited. Nonetheless, we don't allow flying Sweet Bot (we still allow Sweet Tooth or even ground-based Sweet Bot, as long as you don't fly with it) because it is a cheesy mechanic to run from confrontations or shortcut to health. Sweet Tooth is a strong enough vehicle on its own, and if you require flying to perform in TM, you likely aren't very good at the game to begin with.
This user is a proud Canadian.
PSN: Muddy_Maestro | XBL: Muddy Maestro

User Info: Vadimony

Vadimony
9 months ago#9
Talon only ever existed because Jaffe wanted to make an online only game with an objective centered around it; i.e. the projection that is Nuke, as it once was envisioned as. Rather than finding a better means of balancing Nuke (I actually feel that Nuke has many capable aspects even without Talon being involved because of the ability to sabotage the launcher, and the many measures the offensive team can take to counter that defensive tactic but that is a story of itself) regarding the map design and missile protection with the insane AA and navigation routes one can take on a whim, Jaffe made Talon so that it can fly around and "shoot" down the missile because Vermin's Rat Rocket was fruitless and couldn't be relied on. Without Nuke, Talon has no real place with the game's other modes. Hence the reason why Jaffe constantly spent the early moments playing Nuke and trying to show others how "team-friendly" it is... So, unless you play Nuke religiously, I can't quite understand the attraction to a vehicle not even arranged to the purpose of the game. Even if you played Nuke religiously, Talon isn't necessary either.

Talon only really has one perspective in this game: hide and camp. It's simply not able to muster the fight because the game isn't developed well enough to allow a car to fight a flying helicopter; the gameplay involved is sluggish and often ill-advised.

Furthering that argument approach:
1) The game didn't really sell much... The launch ruined that dream.
2) There's hardly any Talon players that did anything except running/ hiding. If they did, they literally didn't exist!
3) Helicopters, regardless of how much armored plating you put on them, are always going to be fragile--even your fancy gunships. Why? The principles involved to keep those volatile objects in the air are quite delicate and there's really no way to change that principle.
4) Using "classic" or any other control option has nothing to do with "aiming up" or whatever you're trying to suggest... That is tied to a different setting. In fact, if I remember correctly, CLASSIC had other flaws related to it.
5) In a direct, head-to-head confrontation between a ground vehicle and Talon, the winner would be the ground vehicle because when you're advancing at a target (SHOOTING MISSILES) as Talon, due to the flying mechanic, and movement direction, the missiles ought to miss entirely because of the Z-axis interfering with the game's aiming systems. So, you'd basically never hit the vehicle, and it'd likely miss unless you, as Talon, went directly into it. Aiming up/ shooting upwards from below is more likely to hit than descending onto a target and shooting down: you'll likely hit just in front of the vehicle, given the momentum. Hence why most Talons hardly do head-to-head combat because they cannot hit anything because of the game's design. They must hover back, or keep their distance to keep their Z-axis relative to the opponents that the Talon aims at.
6) TM Black had a police helicopter, so I don't think you've been much of a fan of the series.
7) Sweet Bot was an issue. Still could be. Only difference between the two is Talon doesn't need a special or turbo and Talon can literally shoot all weapons while hiding. SB can't reach the same damage totals without kill streak stacking... BECAUSE SB can't shoot all of the weapons--with or without double the health. He's harder to kill, but hardly the same threat until he starts a streak.

Now, with the diminished tracking, Talon's more capable at hiding and stalking than SB ever could be...
8) There are also maps where Talon's unbalanced towards:
Diablo like Dead Man's having no remote bombs available and Talon can camp all game.
Metro... Basically, a player must go underground.
Blackrock, Sunsprings, Harbor, and the other maps all have positions that Talon can camp in. There's probably like two maps which are merely too small to camp.
Farewell. :)

User Info: Vadimony

Vadimony
9 months ago#10
And of course, due to how terrible reading your message ends up being, I would recommend more effort in that department than devoting so much love to flying machines. After all, one can't dare attempt to fly without being able to basically muster even a little bit of effort in something like writing coherent comments.
Farewell. :)
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